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Thread: [Spoilers] What the heck is this Kerrigan video all about????

  1. #351

    Default Re: [Spoilers] What the heck is this Kerrigan video all about????

    Quote Originally Posted by TychusFindlay View Post
    I didn't watch the video yet I've been spoiled. So, yeah, I'm a bit bitter at whoever leaked this.
    I can't say for you but I've not come across any article or thread online where the details of the leak were discussed where it was not obvious from the title what the topic of conversation was going to be. Thus, while it is easy to be made aware that a leak occured, I don't think it is easy to have been accidentally exposed to the details of the leak without warning.


    Quote Originally Posted by Louis View Post
    Why do people have this double standard? It's very much expected for RPGS to have all this stuff on the side, but if it's done in an RTS it sucks?
    I don't think it's so much a double standard but the successfulness of its execution. With RPGs, the side-missions tend to explore and develop the main character or side characters (where as in two of the side-stories in SC2, the primary main character leaves/dies/remains unaltered) and there tends to be a sense of accomplishment upon completion (e.g. alters the relationship between the main character and the side character or has some impact to the central storyline).
    Last edited by mr. peasant; 12-23-2010 at 11:36 AM.

  2. #352

    Default Re: [Spoilers] What the heck is this Kerrigan video all about????

    That doesn't explain the popularity of the ME2 loyalty missions because none of them had anything to do with the main story or developed Shepards character. WoL side missions made an effort to at least end the plots with the impression that they're helping to strengthen the revolution somehow (and I'm not talking about money or research here) Bioware games side fluff in general are centred around the secondary characters daddy issues and normally have nothing to do with the plot and main character development. For the record, I prefer Mass Effect characters over most of what we've got from WoL or SC. You're right about Hanson and Tosh never changing, but we make the Tosh decision after hearing from the UNN about how little Tosh cares for casualties. Then there is that choice between sticking up for the defenseless colonists or siding with his old protoss friends. Wasn't as huge as what we get in other RPGs, but it was more than nothing as you put it.

    I think the main difference is quality and depth of writing. You know, just a very long list of little touches like Mordin singing Gilbert and Sullivan, the bad assery attitude of ME2 renegade Garrus, Mirandas ass etc, because god only knows how tightly Bioware has clung to their favourite character templates of BGII.
    Last edited by Louis; 12-23-2010 at 12:11 PM.

  3. #353
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    Default Re: [Spoilers] What the heck is this Kerrigan video all about????

    Quote Originally Posted by mr. peasant View Post
    I don't think it is easy to have been accidentally exposed to the details of the leak without warning.
    You obviously haven't been to the topics ON THIS FORUM that I have been to. There's been replies in unmarked topics that spoiled it for me. In fact, I hadn't even come into this topic or any other topics concerning this leak before I was spoiled.



    Rest In Peace, Old Friend.

  4. #354

    Default Re: [Spoilers] What the heck is this Kerrigan video all about????

    Quote Originally Posted by Louis View Post
    That doesn't explain the popularity of the ME2 loyalty missions because none of them had anything to do with the main story or developed Shepards character. WoL side missions made an effort to at least end the plots with the impression that they're helping to strengthen the revolution somehow (and I'm not talking about money or research here) Bioware games side fluff in general are centred around the secondary characters daddy issues and normally have nothing to do with the plot and main character development.
    Precisely. ME2 explored and developed these side characters. Moreover, the loyalty missions you complete also determine which characters you can use for different purposes during the final mission. In other words, there is a gameplay purpose behind the side missions and thus still tie in to the overall narrative - albeit just not prominently, though still directly. It's little touches like these that make the side missions feel less superfluous in ME2.

    It also helps, like you said, that the characters in ME2 were a lot more likable; coming off as a lot more real and human. Which is ironic, given half of them are aliens and the ones that aren't are essentially mutants with superpowers.

  5. #355

    Default Re: [Spoilers] What the heck is this Kerrigan video all about????

    Ha, the site where the leak was originally posted at first gave out a message that the video is set to private and now check this out:

    Sorry, "Starcraft II - Kerrigan Dies previz (KD series)" was deleted at 11:56:59 Wed Dec 8, 2010. We have no more information about it on our mainframe or elsewhere.

    http://vimeo.com/14564550
    - So, Gerard, I suspect you have a good reason for pulling me away from my Duties.
    - Your Vodka can wait, my good Alexi.


    ================================
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w8WRZcYVbVg -

    Iron man putting on armor

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xAHAUJQ8qGQ -

    Tychus putting on armor
    ================================

    "Also, we've established that the [Wings of Liberty's] storyline was monkey hurlage months ago - so what's the point of all the QQ?," -Gradius

  6. #356

    Default Re: [Spoilers] What the heck is this Kerrigan video all about????

    Quote Originally Posted by RussianSpy27 View Post
    Ha, the site where the leak was originally posted at first gave out a message that the video is set to private and now check this out:

    Sorry, "Starcraft II - Kerrigan Dies previz (KD series)" was deleted at 11:56:59 Wed Dec 8, 2010. We have no more information about it on our mainframe or elsewhere.

    http://vimeo.com/14564550
    Kerrigan dies???
    - "Man is Matter" -
    Joseph Heller - Catch 22

    - "Marines are Goo" -
    BusinessMonkey - SC:Legacy

  7. #357

    Default Re: [Spoilers] What the heck is this Kerrigan video all about????

    Quote Originally Posted by mr. peasant View Post
    Precisely. ME2 explored and developed these side characters. Moreover, the loyalty missions you complete also determine which characters you can use for different purposes during the final mission. In other words, there is a gameplay purpose behind the side missions and thus still tie in to the overall narrative - albeit just not prominently, though still directly. It's little touches like these that make the side missions feel less superfluous in ME2.

    It also helps, like you said, that the characters in ME2 were a lot more likable; coming off as a lot more real and human. Which is ironic, given half of them are aliens and the ones that aren't are essentially mutants with superpowers.
    Not to back down on anything we've just established, but I feel that I underemphasised the lack of relevence of Biowares secondary characters though... nearly all of the best characters in any story medium are all woven into the main narrative or partially serve as a sounding board function for the main characters or the antagonist. We get some of that in WoL, but it's been Bioware standard to just kind of tack every recruitable party member on and to simply have them following the protagonist around for the lulz and it's been progressively more obvious with each game they have released. That is not compelling nor is it believeable and so it's a detriment to Bioware. I'd prefer to have fewer party members than a bunch of them which have no place in hanging around the main character. Just replay Dragon Age Origins some time and you'll see that very few of the recruitable characters ever even mention the blight.... they're far too busy thinking of their daddy issues for that, and if they don't care then why should I care?
    Last edited by Louis; 12-23-2010 at 08:40 PM.

  8. #358

    Default Re: [Spoilers] What the heck is this Kerrigan video all about????

    I think ME2 gets away with it by way of it being military-themed. As far as motivations go, all that is needed is that it be established that the enemy is a credible threat and so, they are doing it because their leader is asking them to. Hence, what ME2 needs to establish is why this ragtag group of (highly trained) misfits are willing to go on a seemingly suicidal mission just on Shepard's say so. Enter, the loyalty missions, where Shepard proves himself (or herself) and earns their trust/respect/gratitude/etc.

    Again, it helps greatly that ME2's characters struck a chord with its players. It's my belief that if a story has great, well-liked characters that people actually care about, they can get away with more shortcomings within the story itself. My rationale here being that people are being sufficiently entertained by the characters on their own.

    This might be a personal thing, but I didn't really find myself particularly invested in the characters in WoL; even Raynor himself. This, I feel, was not helped by their overall lack of appearance during the missions (where the bulk of the game occurs). Compare to SC1 where people are far more attached to Raynor and Tassadar compared to Duke and Raszagal (Aldaris and Mengsk being anomalies thanks to the quality of their performances and their complexity). By putting the heroes in danger and forcing us to try to keep them alive, SC1 helped condition us to care about them. This did not happen in WoL, which I feel contributed to their overall forgetability (standouts being Findlay, Tosh and Mira Han thanks to their respective actors' performances and quirky designs).
    Last edited by mr. peasant; 12-23-2010 at 09:32 PM.

  9. #359

    Default Re: [Spoilers] What the heck is this Kerrigan video all about????

    What other RPGs have you played? FFVI, Planescape Torment are both excellent examples of a supporting cast done right. Baldurs Gate 1 and 2 from Bioware are not as well executed, but it's a hell of a lot better than everything they've done since then.

    BGI: It didn't even emphasise the joinables, and yet it still managed to give the player a good reason for forming a group by making the player character very weak and vulnerable from the outset as opposed to the current video game standard where you're a bad ass killing machine from the outset and don't need no one for survival. It also helped a lot that the enemy was actively huntin you down over the course of the game by sending bounty hunters your way and we're shown that the bastard who killed your foster father very early in the game could easily rip your heart out and eat it in front of you.

    In BGII you and some friends which travelled with you since BGI begin the game as a captive in some dungeon. You've all suffered from torture, the death and loss of loved ones and so you all have a reason apart from friendship and plot requirements to stick together and get a little payback. It had it's share of randomly chosen NPCs who appeared to be in it for the lulz from the outset, and continued to be so, but they all joined you because it was relevant to their interests. They didn't just tag along for your health and happiness. And additionally some of the ones outside of the dungeon had a history with you or were woven into the plot.

    It's fine and plausible in ME because of the setting, but that doesn't fill the void left by uncompelling character origins and motives.
    Last edited by Louis; 12-23-2010 at 10:24 PM.

  10. #360

    Default Re: [Spoilers] What the heck is this Kerrigan video all about????

    Quote Originally Posted by BusinessMonkey View Post
    Kerrigan dies???
    That's the previs version of the Kerrigan flashback cinematic in WoL.
    Don't get your hopes up just yet.

    Kudos to Arkceangel for the Terran avatar and sig!

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