Poll: Should the UED be included in HotS and/or LotV?

[Pandonetho]

BW's Terran campaign was milestones ahead of the SC vanilla Terran campaign IMO, and the story and dialogue was just much better, even if it wasn't directly related to the hybrids.

The fanboy in me would love to see them come back and destroy everyone in the sector but the reality is that they probably won't ever show up again, besides minor references. I mean, how many times were they referenced in WoL? Like once? The goliaths maybe, I don't remember any other UED stuff in the game.

As it stands, I'm pretty dissatisfied with the current Hybrid story. The hybrids will destroy the universe and only the Zerg can save everyone. Besides Raynor (who apparently can kill executor fleets like swatting a fly) the Terrans don't even look like they play a role in the great scheme of things (unless Mengsk really IS involved with Duran in the creation of the hybrids).

[RussianSpy27]

BW's Terran campaign was milestones ahead of the SC vanilla Terran campaign IMO, and the story and dialogue was just much better, even if it wasn't directly related to the hybrids.

The fanboy in me would love to see them come back and destroy everyone in the sector but the reality is that they probably won't ever show up again, besides minor references. I mean, how many times were they referenced in WoL? Like once? The goliaths maybe, I don't remember any other UED stuff in the game.

As it stands, I'm pretty dissatisfied with the current Hybrid story. The hybrids will destroy the universe and only the Zerg can save everyone. Besides Raynor (who apparently can kill executor fleets like swatting a fly) the Terrans don't even look like they play a role in the great scheme of things (unless Mengsk really IS involved with Dugalle in the creation of the hybrids).

Totally agreed on all points. (You mean, UED, not DuGalle - D is dead).

Now imagine that a full-blown punishment fleet, which have been arming for 4 years, to eradicate threats to the future of humankind travels to Koprulu. I'd put my money on this possibility. UED is certainly bound to have a large impact on the story, at least because it's a vast civilisation which you could separate in some respects from our good ol' Terrans. Of Koprulu.

Well, hello there, comrade! It seems there are more of us here than I had originally anticipated :P.

Yes, I certainly agree with you. It's important to try and reach out to Blizzard as much as possible.

So far, the eloquent thread on battle.net by Andrew has proven to at least earn one quick response from Blizzard, so it's important to read Andrew's original posts, and keep posting reasonable arguments on it, here:

http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/374721415

[Cotcan]

I think they should only be slightly involved. Maybe like the survivors of when zerg destroyed their fleet on their way home, come back as mercs or find their own planet.

[Hawki]

I'd say no to a return for the following reasons:

-It's essentially a rehash of Brood War, with the UED coming in during the middle of a conflict.

-At this point in time, any return, gameplay wise, would be limited to a select few units. Kind of like the Burning Legion in Reign of Chaos. Remnants such as those on Abaddon could arguably use K-Sector tech in a scavenging mindset, but a full fledged return would need to have a tech tree in its own right.

-It's trying to compress two many plot points and/or repeat them. Option 1 is a UED return every few years, which dilutes the impact. There's a reason that over 3000 years pass between Sauron's defeat and return in Lord of the Rings, or that centuries pass between Chaos incursions in Warhammer sections. It's so as to not have too many cooks spoil the broth.

Or, you can make it a big plot point, which I think is trying to cover too much. Earth is a plot point on its own. So are the hybrids. It's simply trying to do too much to address both in a single trilogy. It's kind of like trying to deal with the issue of the Burning Legion and the Lich King in Reign of Chaos, or suggesting that Diablo III deals with the plot points of both Hell's return/lack of it and Sanctuary's mysterious importance in the greater scheme of things.

There's also the fact that the UED has had so little EU material dedicated to it. One of the good things about WoL IMO was how it was a good mix of old and new. It's the same format for World of Warcraft, how for each expansion, there was always at least something to tie into it-The Shattering is the most recent example and a good one at that. The UED has only been mentioned a few times and never actually depicted, so there's no prior groundwork.

Simply put, I think the UED has been/should be set for later. One has to flesh out something completely unique from any other terran faction and a trilogy devoted to the cycle doesn't cut that, especially since terrans are perhaps the most minor of the "big three." I think it would be logical to combine the plot points of the UED and other sapients into the same realm of addressing, if that makes sense. UED hates aliens apparently, so discovering how many there are in the galaxy wouldn't do their psyche any favours.

[TheEconomist]

A government created for the primary purpose of making sure that advanced and deadly alien races (which by the way, for the first time in Earth's history were discovered and could hold unlimited scientific potential) don't threaten the planet would not stop after an expeditionary force gets taken out. If anything, the defeat would prone them to invest even more resources into military and intelligence of the sector.

They might not want to do a full invasion, but the legacy should certainly be involved in one way or another.

Precious time would not be wasted. Metzen said the Earth has grown to be a very powerful force with "big guns," so if a full involvement were made, they'd be a fourth key player - a minor involvement would at least (A) re-introduce to newbs what Terran's home-world has been up to since the colonists arrived and (B) continue the epic story begun by DuGalle and Stukoff and at least explain Eath's next move to longtime Brood War fans.

All of which pertain to the lore. I'm referring to my personal interest in the UED. It's already been done. If we're going to get into the lore then, if there was going to be a reintroduction of the UED, it would probably have to be in WOL given the Terran focus. The story from here on should start focusing on larger struggles then the fight between the 3 races. That was SC1. SC2 will be about the Xel'Naga, Hybrids, and whatever else. In order for the UED to be interesting, they'd have to be villains again which doesn't seem like a natural progression this time around.

[RussianSpy27]

I'd say no to a return for the following reasons:

-It's essentially a rehash of Brood War, with the UED coming in during the middle of a conflict.

-At this point in time, any return, gameplay wise, would be limited to a select few units. Kind of like the Burning Legion in Reign of Chaos. Remnants such as those on Abaddon could arguably use K-Sector tech in a scavenging mindset, but a full fledged return would need to have a tech tree in its own right.

-It's trying to compress two many plot points and/or repeat them. Option 1 is a UED return every few years, which dilutes the impact. There's a reason that over 3000 years pass between Sauron's defeat and return in Lord of the Rings, or that centuries pass between Chaos incursions in Warhammer sections. It's so as to not have too many cooks spoil the broth.

Or, you can make it a big plot point, which I think is trying to cover too much. Earth is a plot point on its own. So are the hybrids. It's simply trying to do too much to address both in a single trilogy. It's kind of like trying to deal with the issue of the Burning Legion and the Lich King in Reign of Chaos, or suggesting that Diablo III deals with the plot points of both Hell's return/lack of it and Sanctuary's mysterious importance in the greater scheme of things.

There's also the fact that the UED has had so little EU material dedicated to it. One of the good things about WoL IMO was how it was a good mix of old and new. It's the same format for World of Warcraft, how for each expansion, there was always at least something to tie into it-The Shattering is the most recent example and a good one at that. The UED has only been mentioned a few times and never actually depicted, so there's no prior groundwork.

Simply put, I think the UED has been/should be set for later. One has to flesh out something completely unique from any other terran faction and a trilogy devoted to the cycle doesn't cut that, especially since terrans are perhaps the most minor of the "big three." I think it would be logical to combine the plot points of the UED and other sapients into the same realm of addressing, if that makes sense. UED hates aliens apparently, so discovering how many there are in the galaxy wouldn't do their psyche any favours.

Hawki,

Good, logical points there. I do want to expand on what you're saying about Terrans being the most minor of the three races and say that if UED is included, with the same idea you bring that they hate aliens, they may become either a 4th key player with enough intrigue done right.

I like your Warcraft 3 analogy, and actually feel that the Hybrids, with their few units have already been turned into the Burning Legion in a very clear way. Zerg have been turned into the undead, with the Overmind taking the role of the Lych King and Kerrigan the one of Arthas. UED might become more like Ilidan and his Naga. I really liked how in Frozen Throne, they made it clear that there is another powerful entity around - Naga or Naga + Ilidan and it all played well nicely.

Blizzard divided the games seemingly because the campaign is too large to fit in one game. We all know money played a role, but even assuming they were genuine, a lot of Raynor's missions had nothing to do with the main story and felt added in as space fillers and the campaign unfocused...that made me feel a bit duped with the whole 30 missions per race idea (which I was initially very excited about). So, say in Zerg or Protoss expansions, some levels could be granted to the UED.

But let's agree with you that UED should be saved up for later. My concern then becomes time. HotS is due in 2012. LotV is due 2014. There has been no word about an overall expansion following LotV. When would that come then? 2020?

To try and answer my own question, downloadable mini-campaigns would be a great idea. I am not sure, unfortunately, how much Blizzard will be willing to do it because SC is a multi-player focued game and they would need to rely on the market of fans to purchase those.

What do you think?

~RS

[Brutaxilos]

maybe a secret 3rd expansion after LotV? something like the cataclysm of sc2 with a sudden comeback of a power?

[Hawki]

I'm not that against the UED appearing in some form over the next two installments, provided its along the lines of the remnants. This could concievably fit into HotS-the UED is but one of many factions who'd want revenge on Kerrigan. They could concivably create some extra units to at least make them feel unique.

Blizzard's released story-based downloads before, such as Enslavers II and Loomings. Indeed, Left 2 Die is apparently story based in the sense that it's a genuine event on Meinhoff, rather than the randomness of Aiur Chef for instance. Still, once again, the UED would be rather limited in the game engine.

A StarCraft III is something, I think, that's really nebulous. Gameplay wise, adding a fourth faction would be exceptionally difficult to keep it balanced. Storylinewise, there's the ending of LotV to consider, which I'm predicting will be self enclosed. For terrans, I'm guessing that Valerian will lead the Dominion, closing that issue. For the protoss and zerg, the cycle will be addressed and they can go their own way, probably with the Khalai and Nerazim finally making peace. This may seem high and mighty, but I get the sense of things is that "all things must end." The UED is of course the loose end, but for the K-Sector, I think the story's been told in a sense. Kind of like Warcraft-the jump from Beyond the Dark Portal to Reign of Chaos was large both in time (both real and lore) and scope, going from Alliance vs. Horde to something much greater, with Kalimdor and the Burning Legion finally making an appearance. A shift to UED, I think, would require a similar shift in scope.

Maybe the UED would be one playable race, and two new ones could be fleshed out/created? Few would agree I think, but I think it would serve lore (UED in its own right, give the K-Sector a break) and gameplay (balanced races). I have a few ideas as to which would be the most likely species to flesh out bar creating new ones, but few seem reciprocal to such an idea.

[RussianSpy27]

Yes, of course I mean story-wise. I personally feel that what they had done in W3: The Frozen Throne was very interesting. Naga and Blood Elves, which aren't really playable multi-player races (certain heroes excluded) have been brought in as a totally new force, so with enough well-written intrigue, that's possible to do with the UED.

As for Starcraft 3, that's so far away that we may all get old by the time that's made, and that wouldn't be fun. Many younger fans would forget about Brood War entirely by then and the game would be forced out of the story due to time. So, when I speak about UED, I certainly hope they revisit the powerful and important faction in the near future.

If they won't bring them in for SC2, the only way to do so in a timely fashion would be a well-written and voice-acted downloadable mini-campaign, IMO. Or, of course, if after LotV they create an overarching general expansion pack for all races that would continue the main story - in the tradition of the past and in the timely manner.

[pure.Wasted]

However, WoL set in stone that there are still remnants of the original UED fleet still operating within the K-Sector in signifcant numbers. Then, there is the matter of Stukov. For HotS, I can certainly see Stukov playing a role; perhaps as a mentor to Kerrigan (both were previously infested and have since been 'de-infested'), possibly in exchange for help in reuniting the UED remnants (and possibly sending them back to Earth?).

This. This, this, this a hundred times.

Stukov is still alive. He is also -- potentially -- one of the most interesting characters in the Sector. I mean, he was interesting before he got offed, now imagine the vast scope of themes and characterizations he can cover having been infested and de-?

I'd especially welcome his return as a foil for Kerrigan, a deinfested character who can't let go of that perfect unity and wants to be returned into the "fold." Which IS NOT to say I want him to be a straight-up bad guy, there's a lot more room to explore with him than that... a foil doesn't mean antagonist, because there are other interpretations of "wants to be Zerg" out there than "wants to be pure evil."