SCLegacy SC2Ranks Division Discussion

[Norfindel]

You have to play StarCraft to stay good at it and in the top ranks? What a load of bullshit!

If he was getting his rank lowered because his skill dropped, that would be ok, but with this system, you can have the same skill than another guy, and he will still rank higher than you, because he played more games.

What he said about the rank system makes perfect sense, because including number of games played to compute the position, while matching players with the hidden skill number makes impossible to catch a guy that plays more, even if his skill is the same than yours.

They should just rank and match players with their skill number, that shouldn't be hidden, and forget about artificially raising the rank of people that play a lot.

[SaharaDrac]

You get a bonus pool. What else do you want? Do you think you should be further rewarded for not playing, and the people working harder than you should be punished?

[Hammy]

That makes zero sense Sahara. Everyone gets the same amount of bonus points, whether you're playing or not.

The problem is that blizzard is approaching this like an RPG where your bnet avatar needs to evolve as long as you play, when in fact your score should reflect your skill.

This makes sense to me:
you play => you get better => your score goes up
you play => you don't get better => your score stagnates
you don't play => your skill stagnates => your relative score stagnates

instead of:
you play => your rank goes up, regardless of improvement

The obvious fact that points mean nothing from one week to another is enough proof that the point system is stupid.
Why blizzard couldn't go for a slightly tweaked ELO system (à la KesPa) beats me.
Most players understand that the current points are irrelevant, and that they should have to get better to rank up.

This system isn't keeping me from playing, but it's still a friggin stupid system.

[TheEconomist]

Hmm nah I do not have any bonus pts atm.Plus early in the day i might even get ppl with 200 pts less than me but in the afternoon~midnight I only get 1700+ . Match finder is just awful at times.

Or maybe you just lost a game or two.

[SaharaDrac]

That makes zero sense Sahara. Everyone gets the same amount of bonus points, whether you're playing or not.

....what? No?

[Hammy]

....what? No?

When I massed games I got a bonus point almost every game, or every other game iirc. And from one day to another I always had a couple as well. Like +1 every hour or something?
I've always just assumed bonus points were (incoherently) linear... has anyone looked into this? If I had to guess I'd say +1/hour or something.

[SaharaDrac]

When I massed games I got a bonus point almost every game, or every other game iirc. And from one day to another I always had a couple as well. Like +1 every hour or something?
I've always just assumed bonus points were (incoherently) linear... has anyone looked into this? If I had to guess I'd say +1/hour or something.

No. You get Bonus points for the time spent not playing. It's like rested experience. If you mass gamed and got bonus points every game, that means you spent a long time not playing at all before that.

Please understand what you're talking about before voicing opinions and "correcting" me.

[Hammy]

No I'm saying that between two games, I'll suddenly have a +1 in my bonus points (even though it was zero before that). That's why I think you're always receiving bonus points.
Regardless, between the person who's playing 10 games a day and the person who's playing 10 games a week, the former will probably have a higher score, even if he isn't as good as the first.
Who cares about "hard work". If you're worse than player X, you should be below him in the ranking. And that's what the system should be aiming for.

Please understand what you're talking about before voicing opinions and "correcting" me.

lol:
"Do you think you should be further rewarded for not playing, and the people working harder than you should be punished?"
This still doesn't make sense since bonus points don't seem to be enough/a good enough system to allow for accurate ranking. Check my above post to see what bothers me with the system and tell me if you think it makes sense that points are going up so quickly.

[JackhammerIV]

No. You get Bonus points for the time spent not playing. It's like rested experience. If you mass gamed and got bonus points every game, that means you spent a long time not playing at all before that.

Please understand what you're talking about before voicing opinions and "correcting" me.

Well SaharaDrac not sure if this still applies or not but it was supposedly copied from Battlenet forums from a guy working in blizzard. A rough google search shows a lot of sites having the same relevant section. It is old so they might have changed the system by now.

http://www.mystarcraft.com/news/star...shortcuts.html
http://www.sc2blog.com/2010/03/20/

The section is question is:

Q. What is the bonus pool and how are bonus points acquired?

A. The Bonus Pool (incorrectly called “Rested Points” in some parts of the UI) is an accumulation of points that every player receives whether they’re online and playing or not. They’re essentially used as a means to help give a player a catch-up boost if they haven’t played in a while. The pool does have a cap but it increases slowly until the end of a season.

So unless they changed it then it's safe to assume that everyone accumulates bonus points at the same rate. Roughly about 1 point roughly every 2 hours according to this guy:
http://sc2armory.com/forums/topic/20402

[JackhammerIV]

It's not about "hard work". If you're worse that player X, you should be below him in the ranking. And that's what the system should be aiming for.

In all fairness Hammy what Blizzard said at Blizzcon about the more games you play the better it can place you makes a lot of sense. It's hard to place players based on a few games given it's a computerised system. Unless they somehow develop some crazy algorithm that looks through your build, unit control, apm, money count, macro skills, etc like a pro who can instantly tell you where you rank. I thought the whole point of these ladders and leagues no matter what the game is to just put you where you belong in as few games as possible. Not sure how well Blizzard does with that goal though. Reasonably well i assume. But basically more data (more games played) would be immensely helpful in determining your ranking and skill level.