SC:L Article - Battle.net 2.0 Concerns

[ArcherofAiur]

You first, and mine has blue posts to support it as well.

Saying it will be out in 2 months? Please show.

[Gifted]

this is what I admire, that no matter how much a company is trying to corrupt people remain with their opinion
this is what I love in people, that they are not biased, that they don't suck someone's cock for the sake of staying silent on things that concern people
I can easily explain you my logic
Blizzard went completly mad in what they did in the past year, they think that they can do whatever they want to
they fill people with hope because in the past they always lived up to their games, now it's diffrent with all the bitching in a polite or badass way about Battle.net they didn't care and suddenly month before the release they realize that we want this and that, ignoring every single post in the past at their forums...
so now explain me their logic, cause so far I see only lies

1. I may be misunderstanding, but when you speak about the staying silent part are you implying me?

2. Actually, They knew about what we wanted months ago, not just now. And even then they admitted that they didn't have the resources to logically pull it off in the time they had remaining. Cite the chat room section for example.

The bottom line is that part of the break down in communication exists in examples such as yourself. They can tell you direct information, such as chatrooms will come in the first or second patch after b.net comes out" and you won't believe it. They can acknowledge posts and you say "they are ignoring us". When you move forward with this much emotionally charged argument, I doubt you'd believe them if they told you "Cross-region play is enabled in 29 days". (Not saying that's true, it's just an example)

Now, what I perceive differently from Archer is that much of his frustration may exist from the lack of features, but I think he's as frustrated about the lack of communication regarding VERY important priorities that get lost in the mess of conversation, like the identity issue that NEEDS to be resolved before beta is released.

[ArcherofAiur]

Yah ive seen that arguement before Gifted. That its partially the communities fault for the lack of communication. Thats wrong. The community has for years given every possible type of feedback (constructive, outrage, humourous, articles, petitions, acedotal, etc..) on Battlenet's issues. It is not the community's fault that BNET 2.0 is what it is today. Nor is it any community members fault. So dont try to say it is.

[spychi]

1)no, you did your work great I am talking bout starcraft2.net.pl and other official fansites who attend to Blizzard and are being corrupted with their money, trying to censor everything bad you have to say about either them or BLizzard

2) again I don't want a broken network, if I need to wait I will wait, no claim will satisfy me, because they could also say "screw you guys you bought the game now suffer" just like Rebeilion did with Alien Vs Predator, Activision with Modern Warfare 2
I don't buy pig in a poke, bad experience told me to not trust CO's

[Gifted]

Saying it will be out in 2 months? Please show.

Not that, but the facet that my "false assumption" is based on, that the resources of blizzard are maximized and won't be able to pull off chatrooms (or other additional features that are to be created later) by launch.

It's not gonna happen with the launch, it's just a production issue and we don't have the time to do it at this point. We disappointed our fans, that is a huge bummer, right, and that is never a goal we intentionally pursue, but it's not gonna happen for launch at this point. We simply got too much polish left to do on the rest of the game to also get that in. And we certainly hear that from some of the players but a lot of players are also enjoying Battle.Net quite a bit at this point. So, we surely hear the people's need for additional features that we don't have and we definitely keep working on those down the road. We've got what we've got for launch at this point and it doesn't include chat channels.

Source: http://starcraft2.ingame.de/sc2cl/?m...&id=102427&p=1

Now, the question is... if they maximized their resources and a feature will be able to released at the same time, whether or not the delay was put in place, do you think that a delay would be a viable thing to consider as the feature would not come out faster? (COMMUNITY: Understand this is a theoretical, is Archer replies one way or another will help our conversation but don't hold him to it cause obviously... it's theoretical.)

I will be MORE than happy to give you a full opinion on your question after you answer this one. That way, we both will see each other's sides on the matter and be able to discuss it forward. It may take me some time to fully write up, thus why I'm hitting "post" now instead of typing on.

[Gifted]

1)no, you did your work great I am talking bout starcraft2.net.pl and other official fansites who attend to Blizzard and are being corrupted with their money, trying to censor everything bad you have to say about either them or BLizzard

2) again I don't want a broken network, if I need to wait I will wait, no claim will satisfy me, because they could also say "screw you guys you bought the game now suffer" just like Rebeilion did with Alien Vs Predator, Activision with Modern Warfare 2
I don't buy pig in a poke, bad experience told me to not trust CO's

1. Thanks for answering, I was concerned but it didn't make sense. Glad I asked

2. So your concern is not directly that the product "sucks now" but that their promises they provide could be empty, as has been proven by the industry as of late. I can see that then. So in other words, if by some miracle you could have it injected in your mind that Blizzard will hold up to their promises, you'd be happy. (Obviously that's impossible, but it's the only "magical way" I can imagine to get your side) It must also make it doubly hard to believe them as your perception is that Activision has a large hand in some of the things you are disappointed in. Or at least could have been involved.

Sound about right with me understanding your side?

[Gifted]

Yah ive seen that arguement before Gifted. That its partially the communities fault for the lack of communication. Thats wrong. The community has for years given every possible type of feedback (constructive, outrage, humourous, articles, petitions, acedotal, etc..) on Battlenet's issues. It is not the community's fault that BNET 2.0 is what it is today. Nor is it any community members fault. So dont try to say it is.

Well, I was referring to the scope of "right now" why it may be hard for Blizzard to hear the true message of the community. If you bring it to a different scope, such as for years, then of course it's going to look wrong and I can agree with you on that. The origin of the issue right now is that there was drastic feedback over time that wasn't heeded. We can't change what happened, we can look at the mistakes, the ways to find a solution and move forward.

If you focus too much on "Blizzard botched" then you may miss the point of "What is needed to fix this realistically?"

EDIT: I think this was the cause of the frustration between you and NewComplex, or at least him a few pages back. He was trying to bring up suggestions to handle this realistically (such as his mentions of how we can't pull time magically out of the air and 49 days is not enough time) That's also part of why I asked the question with the same level/point that he was bringing up, that the resources at Blizzard are fully utilizied at this time and has been for months for the production plan they have in place.

(Random note: If we edit a message, we should probably put "EDIT: " in front of it, I've noticed a lot of posts have edits that happen after the replies, so it may help those who join in to understand what's happening and why some of the quotes are incomplete or different, this is part of the reason I didn't multiquote in one post is how that's happened over the last few minutes)

[spychi]

It must also make it doubly hard to believe them as your perception is that Activision has a large hand in some of the things you are disappointed in. Or at least could have been involved.

Sound about right with me understanding your side?

yes, but why do you think that Acti has completly no influence on what Blizzard is doing?

Edit: well actually

so your concern is not directly that the product "sucks now" but that their promises they provide could be empty,

no, both that it sucks now and that they might not want to fix those issues

[Gifted]

yes, but why do you think that Acti has completly no influence on what Blizzard is doing?

Because I have close contacts both at Activision and Blizzard, some of which vital to this game's production. The information that I have is that ultimately the decisions, as Blizzard has been telling us, is Blizzard's choices to make regarding this game. Activision has been a very solid resource for them to pull from and the information they've pulled has influenced their decisions, but the information I'm provided doesn't show any SEMBLANCE of an Activision mastermind pulling strings on the decisions. Blizzard just used them as a resource.

I'll leave it up to you if you want to believe what I just told you and won't fault you if you don't believe it. I have no ability to confirm this information to you in a source. I could go around and quote the countless blue posts and interviews saying this but honestly, if a community member thinks all that information is a PR front, I wouldn't fault them.

What I can say is that even if you believed it, it wouldn't change your concern (at least, from my perception of what you've said) as the concern would still exist. It's not just Activision who made this mistake of dropping games quite well after they were released and you have other companies of concern to pull from.

EDIT: Spychi, regarding your edit above this, I think we're on the same page now, thanks for explaining buddy.

[spychi]

it's not that I am thinking that game is being made by Activision
I just feel it in my bones that they had some influence on what Blizzard did

if we could blame Acti for every single mistake Blizzard did with their game it would be too easy, the worst part is that this Blizzard we all trust/ed failed to do what we expected from them to do with the game, I remember when they said how we are important in SC2 development and if you see how they isoleted themselfs from us it's that much horrific
so it actually puts them in the worst light if Acti didn't even talk with them about the game
Edit:Ghetto nailed the thing I was talking about all the time

I wasn’t around for the “Atari owns the industry” days. But in my lifetime, nothing tops Activision-Blizzard, a corporate culture whose roots lie in four developers who escaped Atari’s corporate culture. I have never seen one company try so hard to tell me this is the product I want.

link to the whole article, I recommend reading it, it should open people's eyes
http://www.the-ghetto.org/content/ba...mer-confidence