Is Blizzard's League system going to keep non-hardcore players in the game?

[Blazur]

I never enjoyed ladder, nor do I find myself enjoying the leagues system of this game. That's not to say it will stop me from playing. It's just I've always enjoyed custom games and games against friends more than ladder.

[Maul]

I don't think it's so bad. If you're a half decent player and lose all your placement matches then you probably just got a bad draw. But it's the same for me when I join a 2v2 or 3v3 on SC1. Sometimes my team's good, sometimes they're terrible. Sometimes you just get unlucky. But if you're going to get upset over losing 5 matches then the problem stems deeper than the placement system. There's always custom games + the final product which will have oh so much more to do than play ladder.

Also with people dropping off, the majority of opt-ins are random and from what I've seen there's been heaps of WoW players getting them. So most people who actually got a key never really cared for StarCraft or perhaps RTS games in particular, or just prefer playing them casually or on singleplayer. This is all fine for the players and more Blizzards fault for the random opt-ins. However, if they're not satisfied with the number of active players the solution is as simple as inviting more players.

[sandwich_bird]

As long as noob have ways to learn the game before taking the placement matches it should be ok. There needs to be comprehensive tutorials that makes you learn all the basic. Those tutorial shouldn't just tell you stuff like "yeah this building make this kind of unit" but also stuff like "never stop building workers, try to always use your minerals, expand, etc". I think this is really the big problem with Warcraft 3 or starcraft. They make you learn the what every building/units do but doesn't go too much in how you actually should play the game. To learn all this stuff you need to go on fansites and such; something that a lot of noob wouldn't bother doing. It would also be good if there was a game analyzer that tells you some of the basic stuff you did wrong.

Some might argue that having all those information so easily at your disposition would dumb down the game or would take the fun of learning away but I disagree. Mastering all the techniques will still be something hard and serious players would eventually go search for the information anyways. This would just be more convenient. Also, those tips/guidelines would mostly just be useful for lower level players. More hardcore players wouldn't need this stuff at the level they are playing.

[hbackstylez]

I do think some players will get turned down as well. I don't know if the practice league is going to get players to the area where they can compete if they have never played starcraft before.

Blizzard has stated that there is a good amount of content dedicated to getting players ready for multilayer competitive play, and I have faith in their plans.

Though, those who are getting placed automatically in copper for losing 5 games straight does sound a bit discouraging. Maybe if your that bad, the game should let you rejoin the practice league and eventually get to try your luck again at placing. Unless the copper league is meant to be full of these new players.

[Crazy_Jonny]

The whole point of the League system was to encourage players of all skill levels to play. I believe Blizzard was under the impression that Bnet can be an intimidating environment for a relatively unskilled player, and so casual players tend to shy away from it.

By dividing people into Leagues based on skill, Blizzard hopes to encourage even mediocre players to play competitively, since they'll be ranked against people of their skill level.

However (and I hope you don't mind using this as an example, LyLunah!), LyLunah just said in her thread:



I'm not trying to belittle LyLunah - I think that anyone who wants to play the game is great. The problem is that despite these measures to make the game less intimidating for newbies, it still seems to be kinda psychologically discouraging to lose all your placement matches, or even to just be in the Copper league. I'm sure some players would quit trying to play competitively altogether rather than try to get better.

Also, it seems as though Blizzard has done quite a few waves of Beta invites, even after their initial attempt to keep numbers around 10,000. I get the impression that people are dropping off, and this is worrying because it's the beta! Entry at the moment is by invitation-only, so you'd think that the people who get in would be people who really want to play the game, and yet Blizzard still seems to need to invite more folks to maintain the population size that they want.

Despite the League system, I can't help but worry that in the end, the casual and less-skilled players are going to drop off as comparatively fast as WarCraft 3's casual crowd.

StarCraft 2's casual crowd will probably be bigger than WC3's, because they are taking larger measures for accessibility, but I don't think it will get to the point where "oh, your grandma can play StarCraft II". There's just only so much you can do to make an RTS that casual friendly. I think once the practice league and challenges from SP are implemented you'll see more newbies coming to the game.

Also, I bet a lot of the people who signed up for the betas are not casual gamers. So people who are newbies and are coming into the beta aren't getting a real idea of what the final product will be like, since most of the players are most likely experienced with RTSs.

[Maul]

As long as noob have ways to learn the game before taking the placement matches it should be ok. There needs to be comprehensive tutorials that makes you learn all the basic. Those tutorial shouldn't just tell you stuff like "yeah this building make this kind of unit" but also stuff like "never stop building workers, try to always use your minerals, expand, etc". I think this is really the big problem with Warcraft 3 or starcraft. They make you learn the what every building/units do but doesn't go too much in how you actually should play the game. To learn all this stuff you need to go on fansites and such; something that a lot of noob wouldn't bother doing. It would also be good if there was a game analyzer that tells you some of the basic stuff you did wrong.

Some might argue that having all those information so easily at your disposition would dumb down the game or would take the fun of learning away but I disagree. Mastering all the techniques will still be something hard and serious players would eventually go search for the information anyways. This would just be more convenient. Also, those tips/guidelines would mostly just be useful for lower level players. More hardcore players wouldn't need this stuff at the level they are playing.

I agree with this as well. Obviously to be a top player you're going to need to visit the fansites and see what the other top players are doing all the time to keep improving further, but a more integrated tutorial that explains some enter level to advanced multiplayer strategies and techniques is only going to make a lot better players.

Still, losing 5 games in a row would not discourage me from working harder to become a better player. But the beta is a watered down and incomplete product, plus it's free, so if people aren't happy with the game in it's current state I hope it doesn't deter them from the final product.

[Asfastasican]

I really don't get what the OP was getting at. This new system is going to have a crack at solving the smurf problem and pit players of similar skill levels against each other. How can this system be any worse than older Blizzard games or other matching in other games?

You can make an argument detailing how matchmaking in this new generation of games has changed gaming for the worse, but Blizzard's new system looks like a breathe of fresh air.

[Kimera757]

I disagree with the OP.

Blizzard isn't necessarily trying to make new players play competitively. Blizzard loves casual players. They're still buying the game, and (hopefully) still playing online. Who cares if they want to stay in copper? For some players, that's preferably to being constantly beat on by higher-league players.

Of course, some players will want to become competitive but that's fine too. Said players, I think, are more likely to train (with challenges, etc) before they even start.

After the beat wipe I lost all 5 of my placement matches (so ended up in copper). It wasn't a horrible deal. I got close to winning some of the later three games, and instead of getting steamrolled, I had a fun (albeit losing) match. And of course (once the game is actually out) newbies won't be "thrown to the wolves". They'll have learned micro (at least for terrans) in the campaign, go through challenges and maybe even played co-op vs AI and 2v2/3v3/4v4 before they play their first placement matches for 1 vs 1.

Though, those who are getting placed automatically in copper for losing 5 games straight does sound a bit discouraging. Maybe if your that bad, the game should let you rejoin the practice league and eventually get to try your luck again at placing. Unless the copper league is meant to be full of these new players.

I disagree. The players in the Practice League tended to be total newbs. There's actually a skill gap between practice and copper. (I tried it out, but left after only two games. I'd probably get more challenge out of the beginner AI.)

[n00bonicPlague]

I recall reading that the developers are actually going to include an optional training segment as part of the package in order to get people warmed-up to multiplayer gameplay. Also, since there is a severe lack of numbers in the beta, the ladder isn't working quite properly since there isn't a large enough pool to choose from. Things will vastly improve upon and slightly after release.

[Rake]

I recall reading that the developers are actually going to include an optional training segment as part of the package in order to get people warmed-up to multiplayer gameplay. Also, since there is a severe lack of numbers in the beta, the ladder isn't working quite properly since there isn't a large enough pool to choose from. Things will vastly improve upon and slightly after release.

Quite right. Once release hits there will be vast numbers of inexperienced players who can play against each other and will be able to win 50% of the time. I also think the practise leagues will makea huge difference, especially if you don't have to do placement matches before you go into them.