Assign Queen to Hatchery

[ArcherofAiur]

Then it would be very valuable competition with SL that one time that you need to cast it from the Queen.

Now suppose that one unit got killed and you wanted to make another one. Or suppose you wanted to start another line.


This reminds me of when people said "oh no one will use Scanner Sweep because it costs 270 min" or "oh it will only be used once when you get DT rushed" And low and behold we still see high level players using Scanner Sweep all the time.

Ive said it before and ill say it again
Looking imbalanced on paper does not nessisarily mean it is imbalanced in the game!

[Aldrius]

I don't remember people saying Scanner Sweep will never be used...

But Scanner Sweep is a touch different than Creep Tumor. You need scanner sweep a lot more often than creep tumor.

Anyway, point is, Spawn Larvae COULD be more interesting, and hence it should be.

[ArcherofAiur]

I don't remember people saying Scanner Sweep will never be used...

But Scanner Sweep is a touch different than Creep Tumor. You need scanner sweep a lot more often than creep tumor.

Anyway, point is, Spawn Larvae COULD be more interesting, and hence it should be.

I think gas should be more interesting. Wheres my improved gas mechanics?

[DemolitionSquid]

Blizzard gave up. They declared intellectual bankruptcy. Instead of continuing to try and make something fun, they simply made gas harder to get.

[ArcherofAiur]

Blizzard gave up. They declared intellectual bankruptcy. Instead of continuing to try and make something fun, they simply made gas harder to get.

Well after gas is made more interesting than they can work on SL as it stands now the queen is more than interesting enough.

[Aldrius]

Well after gas is made more interesting than they can work on SL as it stands now the queen is more than interesting enough.

Gas is a resource mechanic true of all races. Spawn larvae is ONE race's macro mechanic.

Chrono-boost is sort of interesting in how it can affect your teching and build orders, Orbital Command is fairly cool in how you have to choose between it and a solid base defense. And how you make use of scan and MULE.

The Queen is also the most ADVERTISED new Zerg unit. It was the big announcement we got back when they first unveiled the Zerg. And what is it? Well, it spreads the creep... and it adds larvae... and it heals buildings. The larvae thing would be interesting if you could do anything more with them, but otherwise it's an APM sink, a lame macro mechanic. It's not even all that cool a unit.

Blizzard gave up. They declared intellectual bankruptcy. Instead of continuing to try and make something fun, they simply made gas harder to get.

It's not even that harder to get. It just costs you SLIGHTLY more minerals/food to get the same amount. And then if you spend that, you get MORE than you would have in SC1. It's more strategic than it was in the first game.

[TWD]

Yeah but you're forgetting that that "unit" can't move and it takes forever for it's area of effect to grow. You simply can't get the creep to where you want it fast enough for it to make a difference. By the time you even get it past your expansion you could just have another queen and creep dropping overlords to take care of it instead. Hence why it's just not worth it to use that first Queen for anything other than spawn larvae. If you screw up and accumulate enough energy then go ahead, but otherwise the extra units will help you more than the extra creep will.
________
2SEXYHORNY4U

[Nicol Bolas]

Blizzard gave up. They declared intellectual bankruptcy. Instead of continuing to try and make something fun, they simply made gas harder to get.

Considering how lame their attempts to make gas interesting were, we're probably better off. Gross stupidity is not as good as intellectual bankruptcy.

Besides, I don't believe that Blizzard ever really intended to solve the macro problem correctly. Remember: Blizzard had to be told that it existed to begin with. It seems clear that Blizzard didn't intend to make macro more interesting; rather, they decided to just make it take up time and APM in ways that seem different.

See, the lay reviewers would immediately notice the absence of rally mine and MBS. They would immediately call SC2 an antique and relic for not modernizing their game. So instead, they create a small suite of new abilities that are APM sinks. They function similarly to manual mining, but give different advantages. Most important of all, most reviewers would see them as new and different, not realizing that they're mechanically identical to rally mining.

Sure, some of them aren't brainless. You can build strategies around what to Chrono Boost, so that one is a real mechanic. Supply Drop needs to drop more supplies to effectively compete monetarily with MULEs, but it has the potential to do so. But Spawn Larva is something you use on the clock, every clock. No thought, no strategy, just do it or lose.

I just don't think Blizzard really understood the macro problem well enough to solve it, because so many of their solutions never really addressed the inherent mindless problem.

Yeah but you're forgetting that that "unit" can't move and it takes forever for it's area of effect to grow. You simply can't get the creep to where you want it fast enough for it to make a difference. By the time you even get it past your expansion you could just have another queen and creep dropping overlords to take care of it instead.

Building a single Creep Tumor can pay dividends, even with Creep-dropping Overlords. Overlords can (and will) be killed; Creep Tumors are burrowed. So unless they're actually bring detection along, you get a free spotter and patch of Creep.

Note the key word: "single". Their ability to self-replicate means that they don't really contend for Queen energy. There might be a place in an early-game build where you sacrifice an SL cycle for a Tumor, but it's only something you do once.

[ArcherofAiur]

Supply Drop needs to drop more supplies to effectively compete monetarily with MULEs, but it has the potential to do so.

Supply depot isnt a mineral mechanic. Its not supposed to give you more minerals. Its a time mechanic. Thats its saving grace.

Building a single Creep Tumor can pay dividends, even with Creep-dropping Overlords. Overlords can (and will) be killed; Creep Tumors are burrowed. So unless they're actually bring detection along, you get a free spotter and patch of Creep.

Note the key word: "single". Their ability to self-replicate means that they don't really contend for Queen energy. There might be a place in an early-game build where you sacrifice an SL cycle for a Tumor, but it's only something you do once.

Unless you build a second line say connecting your base and nat. Or your want a second line going towards your 2nd expansion.


Each Creep Tumor is a self-generating resource like workers are too minerals. Its benefit only increases as time goes on. id call it exponential but weve had enough argueing over that word to make me never want to use it again

Yeah but you're forgetting that that "unit" can't move and it takes forever for it's area of effect to grow. You simply can't get the creep to where you want it fast enough for it to make a difference. By the time you even get it past your expansion you could just have another queen and creep dropping overlords to take care of it instead. Hence why it's just not worth it to use that first Queen for anything other than spawn larvae. If you screw up and accumulate enough energy then go ahead, but otherwise the extra units will help you more than the extra creep will.

Lets try another analogy (since the unit part is holding you up). Focus now on the map control element. Orbital command can make a cloaked bunker that can then make another cloaked bunker etc...

[DemolitionSquid]

I would kill for Supply Drop for my Pylons. I eat through Psi so friggin fast with CB.