Who misses the Lurker?

[Aldrius]

Can you expand upon the unit, Matt?

It sounds a bit generic right now.

[MattII]

Well I basically designed it as a lurker with a different attack really, one that it can use above ground, Also, what's generic about it? And why is that a problem, the whole Zerg identity is masses of 'generic' units.

[Xeonio]

I don't see the point in bringing lurkers back. The M&M balls of old days aren't as bad as they used to be since medics can't heal each other. A lot of unit combos combat them as opposed to having to rely on a lurker.

It would be nice to have a Zerg unit vs. armored but I don't think its needed. The more I play them the more Zerg feel stronger than the other races. They switch tech at a phenomenal speed thanks to spawn larva. There's been several times when I've baited the opponent into colossus or tanks and then switched to mutas.

I haven't had a chance to try it much as I prefer to go mutas but mass banelings as support for the Hydras vs. Protoss has seemed nice. The banelings roll in taking out the zealots and stalkers so that the hydras can finish off Colossus (assuming they didnt die as well). It seems to be a more expensive fix vs. Colossus than mutas though. Especially when you can harass with the mutas, depending on timing.

Edit: If they do decide to bring something like the lurker back then make it a new unit. I don't want another of the old Zerg units back.

[Aldrius]

Well I basically designed it as a lurker with a different attack really, one that it can use above ground, Also, what's generic about it?

Well DOES it attack while burrowed? You didn't mention that. It just seemed like a Hydralisk with an AoE attack.

And why is that a problem, the whole Zerg identity is masses of 'generic' units.

Exactly. We don't need MORE.

[KillaKhan]

I bet the lurker will be in the Zerg Campaign though. Just like the firebats are in the Terran one.

[TheJet]

Even though I'd like for it to be back, its role overlaps too much with the roach.

Though their attacks are completely different, they are the same in the sense that they force your opponent to get detection or ELSE.

Blizzard implemented the roach over the lurker because they felt that Zerg needed some damage tanking unit other than the Ultralisk.

[MattII]

Well DOES it attack while burrowed? You didn't mention that. It just seemed like a Hydralisk with an AoE attack.

No it doesn't attack while burrowed, but it has a minimum range (unique to 'any' mobile unit), it has a siege range anti-ground attack (okay, there are a few units that have this, but still not many), and it has a delayed hit (there is a delay between shooting at and actually hitting the target), how is that like the Hydralisk?

Exactly. We don't need MORE.

Except that it's less 'generic' than a lot of the Zerg units, because it's impossible to use it as a single unit army because you'd get you ass handed to you (Protoss: Zealot, DT, Zerg: Zergling, Ultra, Baneling, Terran: Siege Tank, Hellion) if you tried.

[TunaFish]

The Lurker's ability to attack while burrowed is essential to its identity. Almost as essential to that identity is the fact that it cannot move while in attack mode. In order to move, it must become defenseless. That makes the unit interesting and unique.

If the Lurker really needs something to make it interesting, I guess I wouldn't mind if it were given an ability. I know that there are seemingly trillions of abilities already in the game, but it seems to me that the Zerg don't have nearly as many units with abilities as the other races.

The Lurker strikes me as a very spider-like unit. If it were given the ability to lay static, stealthed "traps" that basically have the same effect as the "ensnare" ability from SC1, I could see that being interesting. Could synthesize quite nicely with burrowed banelings.

Or perhaps it doesn't even need any changes to make it a more balanced, viable unit...perhaps just number / tier placement tweaking. I have a feeling that one way or another it's going to be back in the game eventually, though.

[arthas]

Even though I'd like for it to be back, its role overlaps too much with the roach.

Though their attacks are completely different, they are the same in the sense that they force your opponent to get detection or ELSE.

Blizzard implemented the roach over the lurker because they felt that Zerg needed some damage tanking unit other than the Ultralisk.

Well burrowed long range linear Aoe great vs enemy small units clustered together on one hand and a 145hp/2 armor/16 damage unit costing 75/25/1supply,With an insane regen at Tier 2 along with burrowed movement and MORE regen....Come to think of it they both have it's uses...one is support the other is tank ! , Someone said that the lurker will return but right now they are simply trying to find a good role for him and i think he is right...

[Aldrius]

Though their attacks are completely different, they are the same in the sense that they force your opponent to get detection or ELSE.

I don't think burrow-move is CORE to the Roach's identity the way burrowing and attacking is to the Lurker.

Blizzard implemented the roach over the lurker because they felt that Zerg needed some damage tanking unit other than the Ultralisk.

Uh, no they didn't. The Roach and Lurker were both in the game for 2 years.

I know that there are seemingly trillions of abilities already in the game, but it seems to me that the Zerg don't have nearly as many units with abilities as the other races.

It's always ALWAYS been that way. If they have abilities, they're passive. In that vein, the Roach's regen, the Corruptor's old turret ability, fit the Zerg.

Even the corruptor having corruption is weird.

The Lurker strikes me as a very spider-like unit. If it were given the ability to lay static, stealthed "traps" that basically have the same effect as the "ensnare" ability from SC1, I could see that being interesting.

Overlaps too much with Fungal Growth.