Idea: Particle Path (Protoss Macro Mechanic)

[ArcherofAiur]

It's not a fair choice-driven mechanic. It's a binary choice of either using it, or not using it. There is no middle ground.

You have an ability that affects a permanent upgrade. Not using this ability is like telling a worker to stop mining. If the player decides to use this ability, they could wait on Spawn Larvae after the research finishes. For this player, there is no compelling reason not to research first since you only need to do it once. If you really need more energy, make more queens.

If the player values Spawn Larvae over research as a decision, then it proves the mechanic does not work - because it's valuing a situational production boost over a PERMANENT upgrade. To this player, research speed would be a waste of energy. This is akin to the PC vs Energy/Shield Battery mechanic that just didn't work. Shield Battery was considered a waste of PC energy.

Once again balanced so the player has to decide whether they want faster larva or faster research. You could cast research and wait for more larva to appear. Or you could cast larva and wait for research to finish.

[Triceron]

Consider the choice between a worker mining or making a building. It's a decision that affects impacts early game, since resources are scarce. As the game progresses and you gain more workers, this has relatively no economical impact since you can make buildings and gain resources at the same time. The choice of using a worker to mine or make a building is completely a non-issue when you have an abundance of workers.

Spawn Larvae and Research falls into this bell curve situation, where the choice impacts your early game the most, but after that becomes a non-issue. Just like if taking workers away to make buildings.

What is the choice for your workers? Priority is mining. You take em off the line only when you need to make a building. The same is for research. You will spend energy on SL until you need to research, at which point you take 1 queen and dedicate it there. After research is done, you continue focusing on SL.

There is no persistent choice-driven mechanic. Compare this to the persistent choice of whether to use MULE or save energy to COMSAT. The importance of both abilities does not bell curve in any phase of the game. You will want to save energy for both abilties and choose to spend on either when the situation asks for it. There is no situation that will force you to use Research over SL, because ultimately you control the situation.

[ArcherofAiur]

How many upgrades in the Zerg tech tree? Id count but im busy handling the Beta investigation.

[MattII]

15 for the general upgrades (5*3), plus the individual unit upgrades and abilities.

[ArcherofAiur]

How much total?

[MattII]

Okay, 15 + Burrow = 16, then we get into the individual ones:
Drone: 0
Zergling: 2
Queen: 0
Baneling: 1
Hydralisk: 1
Roach: 1
Infestor: 4
Lurker: 1
Ultralisk: 1
Overlord: 3
Overseer: 1
Mutalisk: 0
Corruptor: 1
Brood Lord: 0

So that's 32 altogether including abilities, but that's going just by what they've said, rather than by what we think there'd be (like power limit upgrades for every spellcaster), and some of the abilities could be made researchable rather than ready-equipped at a later date. For now though, it's 32.

[ArcherofAiur]

ok good so I just wanted to point out something. Lets say you did a research every 30 seconds like SL, MULE, and PC. Do know when you would run out of abilities to research? About minute 15. And the average game length is 20.

[GnaReffotsirk]

Oh, my, Arch, it just struck me. What if macro abilities like that of PC actually slow down (or totally disable) probe production while it is active? Have you met an idea like this before?

My apologies for the off-topic.

[ArcherofAiur]

Oh, my, Arch, it just struck me. What if macro abilities like that of PC actually slow down (or totally disable) probe production while it is active? Have you met an idea like this before?

My apologies for the off-topic.

A macro mechanic that discourages macroing? No we havn't explored that avenue yet


I know you guys have the best intentions but sometimes it really seems like micro favored players are trying to diminish macro. You cant borrow macro from peter to pay paul.

[Triceron]

Research in the game could have been made instant, but the Research Time mechanic is put in place for a very specific reason. It paces game so that players can upgrade their units, but they can't gain a huge advantage due to the time it takes between each upgrade. Messing around with the pacing is not a good thing.

And again, macro mechanics that affect permanency is NOT a viable option. The fact you can make limitless Queens means you don't have to worry about competing energy between SL and Research. You can have 1 queen dedicated to research at all times, meaning Zerg gets X bonus to research always. If a Zerg player is even interested in increased research speed, they can afford 1 queen for that X% speed bonus.

Bottom line is you're only giving Zerg a tech advantage. There's no interesting choice involved. It's not a choice, it's a binary option.