APC units - getting them to work in StarCraft II UMS

[Kimera757]

I'm assuming there's no APC unit in StarCraft II. Who knows? Blizzard can always surprise us.

IMO, most APC ideas will fail in StarCraft II.

StarCraft and StarCraft II have relatively cheap transport ships already. It's difficult to make APCs cheaper and still worthwhile to use.

Transport ships can travel through the air / space, giving them an advantage over ground-based APCs. You might have to use transports to assault a position (or just use AtG units, since in StarCraft II they are awesome) but APCs don't increase a ground unit's mobility.

In Command & Conquer (a frequent user of APCs), much of the ground is covered in tiberium, poisonous to infantry, so you might want to move troops around in APCs. Also, some of the APCs are stealthy, letting you move forces "under the radar". The former simply won't happen in StarCraft II, I'll leave the idea of stealthy ground APCs as an exercise for the readers.

In StarCraft and StarCraft II, air and ground units move at the same speed (roughly) and vehicles move at the same speed as infantry. (Stimmed marines and upgraded zealots are faster than most vehicles in StarCraft I... faster than anything but an upgraded vulture.) In some game series, like Command & Conquer, vehicles move almost twice as fast as infantry, giving you an incentive to use APCs.

Combo fire: The perennial idea, turning APCs into mobile bunkers. I don't think this is balanceable for StarCraft II, but in a UMS map this is hardly an issue. I bet you can do it with the map editor too.

Squads / Real-life usage:

Using a transport takes a lot of micro. In older versions of C&C, it took more micro than it was worth, IMO. I see two ways around this:

1) Take an idea form C&C III. Make infantry units into squads, and one squad can fit into an APC. Obvious error: StarCraft doesn't use squads. Also, putting a single engineer into an APC (an engineering "squad" was one unit) is kind of silly.

2) In real life, APCs aren't battlefield taxis. (Those are called "jeeps".) APCs carry squads that travel with them all the time, emerging only to fight. (Real life APCs - at least those used by the United States - no longer have firing ports.) APCs deploy on the battlefield already full of infantry, so IMO, producing APCs already full of "light infantry" is doable. That would cut the micro to a low level. Since light infantry are already associated with APCs, you could even have a button to get them to leave, and another to "summon" them back to their individual APCs.

[SpiderBrigade]

2) In real life, APCs aren't battlefield taxis. (Those are called "jeeps".) APCs carry squads that travel with them all the time, emerging only to fight. (Real life APCs - at least those used by the United States - no longer have firing ports.) APCs deploy on the battlefield already full of infantry, so IMO, producing APCs already full of "light infantry" is doable. That would cut the micro to a low level. Since light infantry are already associated with APCs, you could even have a button to get them to leave, and another to "summon" them back to their individual APCs.

Kind of like a ground-based Carrier then? Interesting idea...but I think it's not what people want when they say they want an APC unit. They're imagining a combat taxi...which as you explained makes almost no sense in SC.

[DemolitionSquid]

A long time ago, in a galaxy far, far away... I suggested a Terran APC (although it was more like a jeep). It was inspired by a vehicle in SC:G - the Stinger. I suggested it perform as a mobile Bunker/Turret Hybrid. It had 200 HP, was fast, held 4 infantry, could shoot flak missiles at air targets as the Terran's primary GTA, and cost ~125/25.

But no one else liked the idea. Instead, we were given the (gag) Hellion and Thor.

[Zigurd]

A long time ago, in a galaxy far, far away... I suggested a Terran APC (although it was more like a jeep). It was inspired by a vehicle in SC:G - the Stinger. I suggested it perform as a mobile Bunker/Turret Hybrid. It had 200 HP, was fast, held 4 infantry, could shoot flak missiles at air targets as the Terran's primary GTA, and cost ~125/25.

But no one else liked the idea. Instead, we were given the (gag) Hellion and Thor.

That idea sounds very similar to the Flak truck of Red Alert 2.

[MattII]

APC suggestions are damn near as old as Blizzforum's rebirth (after the big crash in '06), certainly mr. peasant put an idea up in October of that year.

[Whanhee]

I really like the idea of a ground carrier. Probably has no place in the game itself, but maybe in the single player missions. Maybe give it several different types of units that follow it. A repair bot or a scout for vision or a kamikaze drone (lol scarab).

Suppose it only had scouting units, maybe flying camera drones or something. It would be a very powerful scouting tool, but it would also reveal your presence. Kinda like the sensor tower, but mobile. A ground unit with flying vision!

[n00bonicPlague]

Had this random idea for the Terran Dropship once, since it wasn't as up-to-date as the other races' transports (pre-medivac era). It was basically a "Flying Fortress" upgrade that turned it into a bunker, giving it extra armor+HP, allowing any unit to fire out of it, and causing it to move slower. Marines and Ghosts would be able to fire normally, but Hellions, Marauders, Reapers, and Siege Tanks in tank mode would only be able to fire at airborne targets. Siege tanks in siege mode would still be able to shoot at the ground, however.

The other upgrade (meant to go along with that upgrade) allowed the Dropship to drop all of its units at once. It also enhanced the Dropship's speed. This and the other upgrade would be offered as individual upgrades for each Dropship, permitting the player to choose the balance in his/her transportation system's strengths.

[MattII]

That 'Dropship Bunker' (albeit with only infantry firing out) idea never went anywhere, a lot of people said it would make Bunkers more-or-less useless, and a lot of others said it was too flimsy to do much good.

Back in the 'Thor Transportation' (page 14) thread, I proposed the addition of a carryall to carry vehicles esp. the Thor, and an APC would solve the tricky little problem of having to retain the Medivac for infantry, especially if the APC were to get a medical facility upgrade.

[spychi]

Armored Personal Carrier
Type of unit: Medium Transporter
Build from: Factory
Attack: Auto-Cannon - damage 15 + 1 x 3, cooldown 22, normal, (GtoA, GtoG) After upgrading it's attackk with 100mm Bombardment Cannon, damage 30 + 2 x 3 (+ 5 to armored) and t it can only shoot GtoG (the Auto-cannon is removed)
Range of fire: 6 the upgrade increase it's range to 8
Armor: 1 + 1 x 3 Upgrade into a MIB increases it's Armour to 2 and HP to 175
HP: 150
Cost: 150/75 mins/gas

Speed: 3 t/s where Dropship have 2.5 t/s
Supply: 3
Upgrades: Into Barrager -Tech Lab-100mm Bombardment Cannon, cost: 150/150
Special ability: It can load and unload 6 units of infranty(6 Marauders, 6 Marines, 6 Ghosts and 6 Reapers)


The APC can be upgraded in to a Barrager that have an 100mm Bombardment Cannon
Second Upgrade that transform our APC to a MIB (Mobile Infranty Bunker) alows the Infranty to shoot from inside of the MIB but limiting it's load ability to 4 units and slowing it down to 2,2 t/s, removing it's Auto-Cannon and increasing it's HP and Armor, Cost 150/150
Lore
After the Brood War the Terrans needed a groud unit that could quickly transport the infranty to the field of battle, so they've started to make a transport unit that could defence itself, be well armored and be quick.
After modifications of the Stinger (from SC Ghost), making it biger and more armored the Terrans constructed a quick vehicle that could defence itself against any counter attack and give the infranty a good support. It can be upgraded in the tech lab into a Barrager or a MIB

It isn't a replacment of the dropship!

I can has APC?

[Perfecttear]

The ultralisk could transport zerg units around the batlefield and protect them as a meat shield