Thors design and its efficiency

[Hamshank]

I've been advocating since it's introduction for the removal of this unit.
It looks horrible, the gameplay doesn't work, and it renders the siege tank useless (siege take view taken from pro players)

[Pandonetho]

Marines, Thors, Vikings. Units which can fill pretty much any role that may be required.

Marines are hardly jack of all trades. They have a gun, they can shoot ground and air units, and that's somehow jack of all trades? They're no spell casters, they're not tankers, and they need support to actually be useful.

Vikings have to land to shoot at ground units, and have to lift to shoot at air units. Saying the Viking is jack of all trades just because it can attack air and ground units is like saying the Wraith was jack of all trades, the battlecruiser was jack of all trades, so was the Ghost.

Marines can NOT fill any role that is required. As already mentioned they can't cast spells or tank. They die like bugs against any of the heavier units like the Colossus or Lurkers. The viking does not fit every role that you can imagine, asides again from not being able to tank or cast spells it cannot fight AtG or GtA.

Last but not least, the Thor also doesn't fill every niche, mass Thors and see where it gets you, any swarm of units can take down Thors. Thors can't take on mass Zerglings or Hydralisks.

In fact these 3 units that you listed fill considerably different roles.

I'm not even going to bother listing all the ways that's a stupid idea.

Yes that's a great way to prove your point about something.

It looks horrible, the gameplay doesn't work, and it renders the siege tank useless (siege take view taken from pro players)

Gameplay doesn't work? Check, you apparently think you're a balance designer.
Renders the siege tank useless (view taken from pro players)? Check, I believe you because you provided evidence.

[DemolitionSquid]

Marines are hardly jack of all trades. They have a gun, they can shoot ground and air units, and that's somehow jack of all trades? They're no spell casters, they're not tankers, and they need support to actually be useful.

Vikings have to land to shoot at ground units, and have to lift to shoot at air units. This is like saying the Wraith was jack of all trades, the battlecruiser was jack of all trades, so was the Ghost.

Marines can NOT fill any role that is required. As already mentioned they can't cast spells or tank. They die like bugs against any of the heavier units like the Colossus or Lurkers. The viking does not fit every role that you can imagine, asides again from not being able to tank or cast spells it cannot fight AtG or GtA.

Last but not least, the Thor also doesn't fill every niche, mass Thors and see where it gets you, any swarm of units can take down Thors. Thors can't take on mass Zerglings or Hydralisks.

In fact these 3 units that you listed fill considerably different roles.

I'm not going to bother arguing with you. We clearly have different definitions of "jack of all trades."

[Pandonetho]

I'm not going to bother arguing with you. We clearly have different definitions of "jack of all trades."

Yes, yours is "if it can attack ground and air, it's a jack of all trades units!"

Why else would you classify the marine and viking as jack of all trades units?

You have also yet to provide any backup regarding why having 3 "jack of all trade units" is bad.

[DemolitionSquid]

Yes, yours is "if it can attack ground and air, it's a jack of all trades units!"

Why else would you classify the marine and viking as jack of all trades units?

You have also yet to provide any backup regarding why having 3 "jack of all trade units" is bad.

As I said, I'm not going to discuss this with you any further because frankly, you're a dick, and will argue against anything I say just to argue.

[TheEconomist]

I'm going to have to side with Pandonetho on this one

[Pandonetho]

As I said, I'm not going to discuss this with you any further because frankly, you're a dick, and will argue against anything I say just to argue.

Don't flatter yourself. All you do in your arguments is name calling and if you can't back up your argument you just pretend that the other person is an idiot and say "I'm done with you."

I actually think the Thor is a pretty good unit, you think it sucks and can't back it up with jack squat.

[Blazur]

Yes, yours is "if it can attack ground and air, it's a jack of all trades units!"

Why else would you classify the marine and viking as jack of all trades units?

You have also yet to provide any backup regarding why having 3 "jack of all trade units" is bad.

I would agree that the marine and viking are jack's of all trades. Sure they may not have a specialized role, but they can combat any threat. And when used in numbers could easily be a formidable threat. Likewise for the battlecruiser which is another Terran jack-of-all-trade unit.

Granted, when compared to the marine you don't need as many Thor's, but they're still completely capable of taking on both ground or air units. In addition, they can serve as a meatshield while leading a push. And furthermore they double as long-range artillery with their bombardment ability.

The unit just seems forced into the Terran army, and generally unoriginal. They've already got two other two-legged mechs (SCV and Goliath). And now they're adding a giant, slow and cumbersome mech which brings nothing new or exciting to the table.

Yep, the Thor remains my most most disliked unit of SC2.

[TheEconomist]

To me, a jack-of-all-trades has to succeed at all or many things. These things are merely good. Good as in massing Dragoons against Marines. Yes, it's fine but there's better ways to be more efficient.

[Nicol Bolas]

Sure they may not have a specialized role, but they can combat any threat.

Really? Psi Storm (or any other AoE). Watch them combat that. If by "combat", you mean "die quick and bloody," then yes, they can "combat" it. Vikings might be able to get somewhat out of the way of it, but even they will take substantial damage from a single shot of Psi Storm.

Plus, Vikings aren't that good on the ground. Not in terms of damage. Any halfway decent anti-ground unit (Zerglings, Immortals, Zealots, Marauders, Thors, etc) will rip them to shreds cost-for-cost.

And furthermore they double as long-range artillery with their bombardment ability.

No, they don't. The Strike Cannon is a single-target attack. And it's not particularly long ranged (the Thor will be being shot at by whatever it's shooting).

And now they're adding a giant, slow and cumbersome mech which brings nothing new or exciting to the table.

Nothing new? Have you ever watched SC1 when a Terran goes 'Mech? It's just "move forward, Siege up. Force enemy to back up or die. Repeat until dead." There's no mobility at all, save when a Dropship gets directly involved; just a slow, inexorable push across the map.

In SC2, the Terrans can actually be reasonably mobile with their army now. Their 'Mech army isn't centered around protecting a few immobile units anymore. This fact can be directly linked to the presence of the Thor. How is having a mobile Terran 'Mech army "nothing new or exciting?"

Plus, just wait until someone performs a triple-Thor drop to slaughter an expansion in 5 seconds while the enemy has no chance to stop him. How is that "nothing new or exciting?"