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Thread: Blizzard posted a summary of the Starcraft plot

  1. #11

    Default Re: Blizzard posted a summary of the Starcraft plot

    Quote Originally Posted by Turalyon View Post
    My Warcraft lore is sketchy but from what I could tell, the Warcraft2 manual only described Sargeras as a "Daemonlord" but not as an actual Daemon (where it does so for Kil'Jaden). Since this can be interpreted as either being a lord that is a Daemon or a lord of Daemons, there's enough wiggle room there for Warcraft3's additive retcon of him being actually a Titan that was a lord of Daemons, I suppose.
    Thatís really besides the point. The WC3 retcons completely reimagined the universe until its themes were unrecognizable. The WC1/WC2 universes were fairly vague and mysterious, but as a result felt full of story possibilities. WC3 made the universe feel much smaller and imposed a rather childish and inconsistent view of morality on the setting.

    Based on what little we know of WC3ís development, it was originally intended to be closer in tone to the gritty military narrative of WC1/WC2 before Metzen turned it into a schlocky Tolkien clone (no offense to Tolkien).

    I'm not sure what you mean exactly by removing the Xel'naga (entirely?) and replacing it with First Age Protoss specifically since the provocation/impetus for the current conflict between the Zerg and Protoss is dependent on the Xel'naga's interference in the first place. Otherwise, the Zerg would have no reason to seek out the Protoss obsessively nor know about them without the Xel'naga.
    This is fiction. You could easily contrive a bunch of alternative explanations, like the zerg discovering protoss ruins and learning about their advancement from a surviving library cache. If the xelínaga could develop protogenetics science by themselves, then another race like the zerg should be able to do the same.

    If the Protoss were the ones who initiated the Zerg rise rather than the Xel'Naga, then it's kinda difficult to parse how a protracted conflict between Protoss and Zerg could ever arise given the vast initial power differential. If the Protoss could travel across the galaxy and manipulate the evolution of species over generations like the Xel'naga did but still retained their military capability, there's no chance the nascent Zerg would've ever be a threat. This is not even considering contriving how Terrans would enter the picture/stand a chance either.
    Thatís why I specified First Age. As in, the Eon War destroyed their old civilization and the current civilization has not yet reached the same level of advancement.

    My point is that you never needed the xelínaga to make the premise work. You could change them to the protossí own genetic ancestors, keep the same general history outline, and events would still turn out the same.

    For the longest time, SC fans imagined the xelínaga as looking like protoss despite no evidence in the lore for their appearance besides low-res statue doodads in the aiur and shakuras tilesets.

  2. #12

    Default Re: Blizzard posted a summary of the Starcraft plot

    Quote Originally Posted by Nissa View Post
    Tried to read...can't care enough to do so. It's a bit late for Blizz to pretend they care about canon.
    Agreed, If Blizzard doesn't give a fuck about canon, why should we?

    I'd rather see Mid go on his trillionth tirade about how much of a missed opportunity SC as a whole was than read some mental gymnastics from Modern Blizz.

  3. #13

    Default Re: Blizzard posted a summary of the Starcraft plot

    Quote Originally Posted by KaiserStratosTygo View Post
    Agreed, If Blizzard doesn't give a fuck about canon, why should we?

    I'd rather see Mid go on his trillionth tirade about how much of a missed opportunity SC as a whole was than read some mental gymnastics from Modern Blizz.
    Honestly, I donít expect great writing from video games in general. The RTS format in particular is difficult to tell stories with because it is so different from the more popular first- and third-person perspective games. I do think that military fiction genre is a better fit for RTS than any other genre, like romance or superheroes. If I have to have a not-great plot, then I prefer one that plays to the strengths of the format.

    I think Starcraft should have focused on the invasion of human space and how the different sides react to the events. Showcasing the whole war isnít feasible, so I think Mar Sara should have been the theater of the entire game rather than abandoned after the first third of episode 1. Keeping the focus on one planet rather than revolving the entire universe around Raynor would have neatly avoided most of the problems I have with the storytelling.

  4. #14

    Default Re: Blizzard posted a summary of the Starcraft plot

    Quote Originally Posted by Mislagnissa View Post
    Honestly, I donít expect great writing from video games in general. The RTS format in particular is difficult to tell stories with because it is so different from the more popular first- and third-person perspective games. I do think that military fiction genre is a better fit for RTS than any other genre, like romance or superheroes. If I have to have a not-great plot, then I prefer one that plays to the strengths of the format.

    I think Starcraft should have focused on the invasion of human space and how the different sides react to the events. Showcasing the whole war isnít feasible, so I think Mar Sara should have been the theater of the entire game rather than abandoned after the first third of episode 1. Keeping the focus on one planet rather than revolving the entire universe around Raynor would have neatly avoided most of the problems I have with the storytelling.
    Yeah, SC works better as an EVENT DRIVEN narrative, and not a character Driven one, there should've been scores of different characters that you don't see much of in each episode but gets more spotlight in some side campaigns.

    also I think showcasing the whole war IS feasible, through various side stories, and parallel stories that Video games just don't like to portray so much anymore.

    Lastly, I think its totally possible for games and especially RTS to have great stories, its just that the devs of these products either have no confidence in their ability to tell stories or fall into the trappings of "RTS' don't have good stories usually, so we shouldn't try"

  5. #15

    Default Re: Blizzard posted a summary of the Starcraft plot

    Quote Originally Posted by KaiserStratosTygo View Post
    Yeah, SC works better as an EVENT DRIVEN narrative, and not a character Driven one, there should've been scores of different characters that you don't see much of in each episode but gets more spotlight in some side campaigns.

    also I think showcasing the whole war IS feasible, through various side stories, and parallel stories that Video games just don't like to portray so much anymore.

    Lastly, I think its totally possible for games and especially RTS to have great stories, its just that the devs of these products either have no confidence in their ability to tell stories or fall into the trappings of "RTS' don't have good stories usually, so we shouldn't try"
    I can agree with that. Any suggestions on what plots we would tell? Iím tired of criticizing Starcraft and would like to do some constructive brainstorming or something.

  6. #16

    Default Re: Blizzard posted a summary of the Starcraft plot

    Iím on the unofficial SCLegacy discord if anybody wants to real time chat: https://discord.gg/CyUvEBy

  7. #17

    Default Re: Blizzard posted a summary of the Starcraft plot

    Quote Originally Posted by Mislagnissa View Post
    The WC3 retcons completely reimagined the universe until its themes were unrecognizable. The WC1/WC2 universes were fairly vague and mysterious, but as a result felt full of story possibilities.
    These two statements don't correlate. If WC1/2 had nothing to them (being "fairly vague and mysterious" as you say), then Wc3 didn't "completely reimagine" anything. The Wc1/2 "story" was nothing more than a perfunctory exposition dump before the gameplay started (not that I mind then or now for that matter). If anything Wc3 gave the IP a story/narrative that the previous entries distinctly lacked (subjective like/dislike of what it entailed being irrelevant).

    Quote Originally Posted by Mislagnissa View Post
    WC3 made the universe feel much smaller and imposed a rather childish and inconsistent view of morality on the setting.
    This is a highly subjective and debatable opinion since the WC3 universe was technically/objectively larger as it went beyond just "humans and orcs fighting each other just because". The morality of Warcraft has always remained the same: good vs evil and to say otherwise is blatant falsehood. The "inconsistency" that you perceive in Wc3 is that some humans are actually evil now (Arthas, Kel'Thuzad) and some orcs are good (Thrall). Some people will call that an extra layer of complexity.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mislagnissa View Post
    Based on what little we know of WC3ís development, it was originally intended to be closer in tone to the gritty military narrative of WC1/WC2 before Metzen turned it into a schlocky Tolkien clone (no offense to Tolkien).
    You sure love conjecture to fuel your cognitive bias and pass it off as objective truth, don't you? Not everything has to be a gritty military narrative, nor did Wc1/Wc2 ever feel that way either. It was always a basic good (humans) vs evil (orcs) fantasy setup and nothing more.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mislagnissa View Post
    This is fiction. You could easily contrive a bunch of alternative explanations, like the zerg discovering protoss ruins and learning about their advancement from a surviving library cache. If the xelínaga could develop protogenetics science by themselves, then another race like the zerg should be able to do the same.
    Having the Protoss take the Xel'Naga role yet retain their martial expertise (which the Xel'Naga did not have) makes the Protoss even more OP than was implied in what we actually got. It would be ludicrous to conceive the nascent Zerg (let alone Terrans) would ever stand a chance against them in this scenario. It would also be contrived to have a Protoss civil war to conveniently cripple them enough to allow the Zerg to somehow develop into a power that would become and equal threat to them when they are aware of each other from the start. The Zerg are powerful against the Protoss because they had the element of surprise and time to develop themselves (by spreading across the galaxy) before confronting them - none of which can be used in your scenario. Your scenario would require even more contrivance to justify why the Zerg would ever be a threat and why the Protoss couldn't just snuff them out at the earliest opportunity.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mislagnissa View Post
    Thatís why I specified First Age. As in, the Eon War destroyed their old civilization and the current civilization has not yet reached the same level of advancement.
    Going the classic elven/WH40K Eldar route I see?
    Yes, that's right! That is indeed ME on the right.


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  8. #18

    Default Re: Blizzard posted a summary of the Starcraft plot

    Thank you for correcting me.

    Anyway, does anyone want to take me up on that offer? It still stands.

  9. #19

    Default Re: Blizzard posted a summary of the Starcraft plot

    Quote Originally Posted by Mislagnissa View Post
    Thank you for correcting me.
    Your condescension is appreciated!
    Yes, that's right! That is indeed ME on the right.


    _______________________________________________

  10. #20

    Default Re: Blizzard posted a summary of the Starcraft plot

    Okay, I will start.

    I think the Confederacy was sadly underutilized. The Dominion was the same thing, except with Mengsk's face tacked on. I think the Old Families offer far more opportunity for politics. Remember, the Mengsks were an Old Family: they and their Sons of Korhal lackeys were just as corrupt and evil as all the rest, depending on how charitable you want to be to the terrans.

    But the Old Families don't need to be universally evil. I had this idea that the Magistrate of Mar Sara could make different decisions if Tassadar had instead offered an alliance, removing the need to consort with the evil Sons of Korhal. Rather than thoughtlessly overthrow the Confederacy and leave dangerous power vacuums, maybe try to reform undesirable elements. Like Duke irresponsibly using the fringe worlds as testing labs.

    Treat the Confederacy as, I don't know, an actual confederation of colonies?

    Maybe bring in the UED earlier and depict them as more heroic than the space nazis they're supposedly supposed to be (but are never actually shown to be). Maybe they arrived instead to damper the volatile politics of Koprulu because it endangers the bottom line? We can ignore the whole lost colony bit because was retconned in nonsense anyway, since even Blizz seems to forget it.

    Maybe, I don't know, have the zerg invade Earth? The protoss attack Tau Ceti?

    The possibilities are endless.

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