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Thread: Did the Xel'Naga Foresee Their Defeat?

  1. #11

    Default Re: Did the Xel'Naga Foresee Their Defeat?

    With regard to preparations, I suspect Kerrigan and Abathur sifted through her Primal genetics to identify what mechanism made Zerg susceptible to Amon's control, and dispersed a counter as much as possible across the Swarm. Otherwise, I simply don't see her having the willpower to oppose his rule of the Swarm.

  2. #12
    Gradius's Avatar SC:L Addict
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    Default Re: Did the Xel'Naga Foresee Their Defeat?

    How is it that Ouros got captured considering the main Xel'Naga defeated Amon at Ulnar? Did the rest of the XelNaga really just go back to sleep when the job wasn't done, Duran was still running around, Amon was killing other Xel'Naga in the void, and Ouros was prisoner in the void?

    Ouros can communicate with beings in the living world. He could send a message to the rest of the XelNaga and be like "yo don't go to sleep, I'm a prisoner here and Amon is planning to kill you all."
    Last edited by Gradius; 06-26-2017 at 05:59 PM.

  3. #13

    Default Re: Did the Xel'Naga Foresee Their Defeat?

    Did the rest of the XelNaga really just go back to sleep when the job wasn't done, Duran was still running around, Amon was killing other Xel'Naga in the void
    Mmmmyep. That happened.
    Aaand sold.


    Be it through hallowed grounds or lands of sorrow
    The Forger's wake is bereft and fallow

    Is the residuum worth the cost of destruction and maiming;
    Or is the shaping a culling and exercise in taming?

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    But be wary through what thickets it winds.

  4. #14

    Default Re: Did the Xel'Naga Foresee Their Defeat?

    Quote Originally Posted by Visions of Khas View Post
    Kind of makes me wonder about Zeratul's and the Overmind's vision of an apocalyptic future. Doubtless it was granted by Ourous; but was it a simulated future meant as a scare tactic, or a clear view of an alternate timeline?
    I'd like to think that it was a fabrication of Ouros and that he was manipulating things to his own ends (creating a self-fulfilling prophecy), just like how Amon was "supposedly" masterplanning the end of the cycle (which still makes no sense since he already accomplished that from the get-go by neutering the Zerg and Protoss from becoming ever becoming Xel'Naga). All them Xel'Naga are devious and deceitful arseholes in Sc2. So, in a round about way, it's fitting that Kerrigan is now one of them.

    Course, it doesn't explain why the temples seemingly have images of Kerrigan in them. Maybe Ouros discovered/knew about the Terrans right from the beginning and secretly prepared the way for them to eventually counter Amon's scheme. I mean, it can't be that far-fetched when we consider the "planning" required in Amon's scheme being almost pulled off.

    Quote Originally Posted by Visions of Khas View Post
    Whom else saw these visions? Some Terran cults were exposed to it. Does Amon not have the same ability? Kerrigan claimed to be able to see multiple timelines when she ascended.
    When you think about it, out of all the other Xel'Naga that were killed, Ouros is the only other one (apart from Amon's lackey Duran that is) that's not killed. Surely, there must be a reason, right? I imagine that if precognition does exist within the Xel'Naga, that only Ouros had some degree of it. It's the only reason I can think of as to why Amon would spare/ imprison him and not kill him much earlier (since he would try to use it to his advantage).

    Quote Originally Posted by Visions of Khas View Post
    With regard to preparations, I suspect Kerrigan and Abathur sifted through her Primal genetics to identify what mechanism made Zerg susceptible to Amon's control, and dispersed a counter as much as possible across the Swarm. Otherwise, I simply don't see her having the willpower to oppose his rule of the Swarm.
    But Primal Kerrigan is on a different level than original infested Kerrigan. She supposedly has both the purities now which I assume means she has more power over the Swarm and more than what Amon does over the Zerg compared to before? *shrug*

    Quote Originally Posted by Gradius View Post
    How is it that Ouros got captured considering the main Xel'Naga defeated Amon at Ulnar? Did the rest of the XelNaga really just go back to sleep when the job wasn't done, Duran was still running around, Amon was killing other Xel'Naga in the void, and Ouros was prisoner in the void?

    Ouros can communicate with beings in the living world. He could send a message to the rest of the XelNaga and be like "yo don't go to sleep, I'm a prisoner here and Amon is planning to kill you all."
    This line of questioning is based on the presumption that Ouros is naturally and morally "good" (as in that he bears good-will to other Xel'Naga and other lifeforms), of the "right mind" and/or has no other hidden agenda. We really know little about him but we can infer a lot from what we do get. On the face of things, he's willing to be deceitful (pretending to be Tassdar) to get what he wants (to pass on his legacy to Kerrigan specifically). He's willing to do this no matter the consequence. He urges comparatively more morally good people to risk their lives and others under them to bring a person who relished killing people, had killed "billions" and was willingly doing immense collateral damage trying to ultimately kill one man as a means for "atonement" of her past crimes, to him and give that person who is obviously of not sound mind herself, even more power. Hmmmm.

    Makes you wonder really. Maybe Ouros was actually in partnership with Amon and they had a falling out leading to the state we eventually see them at. Who knows?
    Last edited by Turalyon; 06-27-2017 at 05:06 AM.
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  5. #15

    Default Re: Did the Xel'Naga Foresee Their Defeat?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gradius View Post
    How is it that Ouros got captured considering the main Xel'Naga defeated Amon at Ulnar? Did the rest of the XelNaga really just go back to sleep when the job wasn't done, Duran was still running around, Amon was killing other Xel'Naga in the void, and Ouros was prisoner in the void?

    Ouros can communicate with beings in the living world. He could send a message to the rest of the XelNaga and be like "yo don't go to sleep, I'm a prisoner here and Amon is planning to kill you all."
    Possibly, unless Amon blocked the communications or something.

    Or it's possible that when the Xel'Naga won the battle at Zerus, Ouros made a sacrifice to seal Amon in the Void or something like that. As a result, all the other Xel'Naga thought Ouros was killed, not realizing Amon kept him alive (this of course would then depend on just what abilities Amon still had in defeat)


    Quote Originally Posted by Visions of Khas View Post
    With regard to preparations, I suspect Kerrigan and Abathur sifted through her Primal genetics to identify what mechanism made Zerg susceptible to Amon's control, and dispersed a counter as much as possible across the Swarm. Otherwise, I simply don't see her having the willpower to oppose his rule of the Swarm.
    I doubt that'd have made a difference. I'm willing to bet the only reason Amon didn't contest her for control over the swarm in LotV was more due to because he had the Golden Armada and the fact the swarm wasn't at its peak (even by the end of HotS it was still only a shadow of its former self compared to the beginning of WoL)

  6. #16

    Default Re: Did the Xel'Naga Foresee Their Defeat?

    Quote Originally Posted by Turalyon View Post
    I'd like to think that it was a fabrication of Ouros and that he was manipulating things to his own ends (creating a self-fulfilling prophecy), just like how Amon was "supposedly" masterplanning the end of the cycle (which still makes no sense since he already accomplished that from the get-go by neutering the Zerg and Protoss from becoming ever becoming Xel'Naga). All them Xel'Naga are devious and deceitful arseholes in Sc2. So, in a round about way, it's fitting that Kerrigan is now one of them.
    For this, I mostly disliked that Ouros still saw himself so above others, seeing the Protoss only as lesser beings. This is why I had hoped that by the time of Evolution the Protoss people would stop seeing the Xel'Naga in such a way. Or at the very least, see them on a lower level than holy gods. Of course if Kerrigan is still one, then obviously they'd look in the other direction.

    Quote Originally Posted by Turalyon View Post
    But Primal Kerrigan is on a different level than original infested Kerrigan. She supposedly has both the purities now which I assume means she has more power over the Swarm and more than what Amon does over the Zerg compared to before? *shrug*
    It is NOT purity. If she had that purity she never would have needed Dehaka's help with the Psi Destroyer. As I see it, there's still enough corrupted Zerg blood in her, just not enough for Amon to influence or control. And as for being able to control the swarm like that, I doubt it. Amon is the creator of the corrupted swarm, I felt he would have ensured his control cannot be taken away. The main Q here is did Amon actually make a concerted effort to take the swarm away from Kerrigan by the time of LotV, or did he just feel the feral Zerg on Aiur were enough.

  7. #17

    Default Re: Did the Xel'Naga Foresee Their Defeat?

    Quote Originally Posted by Turalyon View Post

    Course, it doesn't explain why the temples seemingly have images of Kerrigan in them. Maybe Ouros discovered/knew about the Terrans right from the beginning and secretly prepared the way for them to eventually counter Amon's scheme. I mean, it can't be that far-fetched when we consider the "planning" required in Amon's scheme being almost pulled off.
    In essence all murals and prophecies are manifestations of the manipulation of the matter of, ouros , in essence the mural that sees for artanis was created specifically to influence in artanis did not exist previously golds could influence slightly in ulnar to modify the walls, xelnaga skill about their constructs
    Makes you wonder really. Maybe Ouros was actually in partnership with Amon and they had a falling out leading to the state we eventually see them at. Who knows?
    cool idea

  8. #18

    Default Re: Did the Xel'Naga Foresee Their Defeat?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gradius View Post
    How is it that Ouros got captured considering the main Xel'Naga defeated Amon at Ulnar? Did the rest of the XelNaga really just go back to sleep when the job wasn't done, Duran was still running around, Amon was killing other Xel'Naga in the void, and Ouros was prisoner in the void?

    Ouros can communicate with beings in the living world. He could send a message to the rest of the XelNaga and be like "yo don't go to sleep, I'm a prisoner here and Amon is planning to kill you all."
    You know Gradius, another possibility (given that Blizzard didn't explain all this) is that perhaps Ouros was a Xel'Naga Amon had captured and imprisoned LONG before any of all this got off the ground, as in well before he even went to Aiur to uplift the Protoss people. Of course, if we're to use that, then it makes you wonder why did the other Xel'Naga just forget about him and everything....

  9. #19
    Gradius's Avatar SC:L Addict
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    Default Re: Did the Xel'Naga Foresee Their Defeat?

    Quote Originally Posted by ragnarok View Post
    Of course, if we're to use that, then it makes you wonder why did the other Xel'Naga just forget about him and everything....
    Exactly, so why did you even bother bringing this up?

  10. #20

    Default Re: Did the Xel'Naga Foresee Their Defeat?

    Quote Originally Posted by ragnarok View Post
    It is NOT purity.
    The purities are retconned from essence into "great changeability" and form into "great psionic capability" in Sc2. Ouros believes Kerrigan fulfills this requirement which leads him to endow his power to her. Therefore, by the games logic, she has both purities.

    Quote Originally Posted by ragnarok View Post
    If she had that purity she never would have needed Dehaka's help with the Psi Destroyer.
    It has nothing to do with the purities. The Psi Destroyer works against those who utilise the psionic hive-mind that "Swarm Zerg" use. Kerrigan still uses that to control the "Swarm Zerg" so that's why she's still vulnerable to it.

    Dehaka and the "Primal Zerg" don't have a psionic hive-mind link, so they are not affected by it even though being "Primal Zerg" does apparently mean having this recently retconned version of "purity of essence".
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