Karune posts regarding PC, Batch 53, and YouTube (09/25/09)

[ArcherofAiur]

Sigh why do you guys keep acting like I like Proton Charge? Thats never been my arguement. You guys just keep fanatically argueing against everything to the point that now your claiming making workers is at random intervals.

[PsiWarp]

Having been repeatedly reminded of a certain area of things, where one soon finds annoyance of, does that to people sometimes. Shame this macro issue hasn't been beaten to death yet, such a tiresome and repetitive thing as all of the mechanics now stand.


-Psi

[Pandonetho]

hame this macro issue hasn't been beaten to death yet,

I wonder why... *looks at Archer*

[ArcherofAiur]

Its all...

part of the plan...

[Santrega]

They are repetitive. But they're also not. You have to do them, but its not at a set rate. You don't have to build supply depots every 30 seconds. But you do have to build them eventually. PC has to be every X seconds.

PC: Must be done, every X seconds
Everything Else: Must be done, at random intervals

Why is that so hard for you to understand?

Why does PC have to be done every X seconds? In the third battle report there were several occasions where probes weren't charged. In the 2on2s recently updated there were several occasions where probes werent charged.

The point is, it doesnt have to be done every X seconds. To use PC perfectly, you would do it instantly every time it wore off. But, we aren't talking about using it perfectly, we are talking about forced repetition. I see PC, mule, and larva injection as something you use when you are running out of minerals or units (in the case of larva injection).

Heres my problem DS, nicol, and blazur.

If I am currently gathering more minerals than I can spend at a point in time, why would I waste time casting PC, or mule, or larva injection for drone purposes? It makes absolutely no sense to continue to use it if I am not having a problem with my production. Yes, I could use it anyway, and plan for the future of the game where I may or may not need the resources, however that is a choice, not a requirement.

Say I am at 180/200 on supply, and I have killed off 2 of my opponents 3 bases, and most of his army. I could spend time with a bit of macro to max my supply, I could expand again to make sure I have enough resources, or I could just attack and hope that he doesn't pull off some crazy miracle and get back into the game. Those are choices not something forced on you.

If I have 5000 minerals per minute coming in (without PC, mule, or additional drones), and I am only spending 3000 minerals per minute with my production, why would I feel the need at that moment to use PC? If you wouldn't, wouldnt that make PC situational? I could choose to use PC and try to gather much more resources, however, if I feel I am already ahead economically, say because I have successfully harassed my opponent, or I have killed one of his bases, or I have more bases, I may choose to spend all my time on the attack, thats a choice.

[Pandonetho]

If I am currently gathering more minerals than I can spend at a point in time,

When is this EVER the case? You can never have more minerals than you can spend. If you're already producing units, either build more workers, tech, expand, build supplies, or create more production buildings.

why would I waste time casting PC, or mule, or larva injection for drone purposes?

Because your obelisk is useless for everything else? Why WOULDN'T you cast PC, if you have more money than you can spend as you say? If you did have that much money, you'd already have other obelisks taking care of casting the other spells that it uses. As for the larva injection, who said it was bad because it was only used for drone injection? It's only used because it's too useful not to be used. MULE is the only one that has a competitor which is scan, a scan is always useful.

Yes, I could use it anyway, and plan for the future of the game where I may or may not need the resources, however that is a choice, not a requirement.

Er, neither is building workers... what happens when you don't build workers and your opponent does? He gets ahead of you in economy... what happens when you decide not to use PC (for whatever reason) and your opponent does? He gets ahead of you.

Say I am at 180/200 on supply, and I have killed off 2 of my opponents 3 bases, and most of his army.

Why such a terrible example? You've already won at this point.

[Santrega]

When is this EVER the case? You can never have more minerals than you can spend. If you're already producing units, either build more workers, tech, expand, build supplies, or create more production buildings.

What in the world are you on? Show me a replay where you personally always keep your minerals under 1k the entire game, I bet you that you dont have any like that.

Most casual players rarely spend their resources as they get them, rarely. So the resources simply pile up. If I have 10k extra minerals just sitting there, and I simply expand like normal, what in the world would possess me to cast PC?

I want to add that im not arguing that there doesnt need to be something more given to the obelisk as a competitive ability, giving more choice. I think PC as it is being the only option is boring as well. However, I dont believe it needs to be always used. It wont be always used as it is now, even as the only thing, it simply will be the only thing used when you do need faster resource harvesting.

[ArcherofAiur]

What in the world are you on? Show me a replay where you personally always keep your minerals under 1k the entire game, I bet you that you dont have any like that.

Stop living in the real world. You cant design games like that.

[Nicol Bolas]

If I am currently gathering more minerals than I can spend at a point in time, why would I waste time casting PC, or mule, or larva injection for drone purposes? It makes absolutely no sense to continue to use it if I am not having a problem with my production.

If you are making more money than you can spend, the answer is obvious: build more production infrastructure. Clearly you need more Gateways/etc or Barracks/Factories/StarPorts. The correct answer is almost never to stop getting more money.

Say I am at 180/200 on supply, and I have killed off 2 of my opponents 3 bases, and most of his army.

Then you've already won and a 5-year-old can finish the game for you.

Most casual players rarely spend their resources as they get them, rarely.

We're not talking about what "most casual players" would do. "Most casual players" would pulse PC occasionally instead of regularly and will often forget to build workers.

That people can make the wrong decisions doesn't make those decisions any less wrong.

[sandwich_bird]

What in the world are you on? Show me a replay where you personally always keep your minerals under 1k the entire game, I bet you that you dont have any like that.

Most casual players rarely spend their resources as they get them, rarely. So the resources simply pile up. If I have 10k extra minerals just sitting there, and I simply expand like normal, what in the world would possess me to cast PC?

I want to add that im not arguing that there doesnt need to be something more given to the obelisk as a competitive ability, giving more choice. I think PC as it is being the only option is boring as well. However, I dont believe it needs to be always used. It wont be always used as it is now, even as the only thing, it simply will be the only thing used when you do need faster resource harvesting.

Casual gamers don't count because you can't play starcraft multiplayer mode casually and win. So PC doesn't affect casual players that much. If you want to win at StarCraft you have to either play a bit each day or play a lot at irregular intervals, all of this without falling in the hardcore category. So lets call the category between casual and hardcore "standard". Those are the players (with the hardcore category) that will play multiplayer the most and trust me no standard player would end with 1k for more than 15-25 sec except in late game or if they are playing against a casual player. At this level of play PC would really be a deciding factor.