Karune posts regarding PC, Batch 53, and YouTube (09/25/09)

[DemolitionSquid]

Give us an estamate

Do you stop building before 5 minutes, before 10 minutes, before 15 minutes, before 20 minutes or before 25 minutes?

There is no correct answer. Its variable depending on the number of expansions, the size of the map, the length of the game, and many other factors. Some games you will build workers all game because the game is only 5 minutes long.

Man. You bash my PC calculations because I can't include every single variable factor, and then you go and try to use variable factors to prove your point like its perfectly acceptable. Stop the hypocrisy already.

[ArcherofAiur]

Average being the key word. Im not argueing things like PC is 100% imbalancable. Im argueing most of the game your making probes every 30 seconds repeatedly.


Anyway for reference in this game we can see that bisu is still making probes at minute 15.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Msa2c...embedded#t=562

[DemolitionSquid]

He has 3 bases and isn't even at 100 supply. Of course hes still building Probes. Did I not just say it was dependent on expansions and supply cap? Geez.

[ArcherofAiur]

I didnt say it wasnt.

I gave an example that players are still building workers at minute 15. Im not really concerned if you stop making workers at minute 20 but your still casting PC. I care about what your doing the majority of the game.

[Blazur]

Give us an estamate

Do you stop building before 5 minutes, before 10 minutes, before 15 minutes, before 20 minutes or before 25 minutes?

You can't compare the two. Building workers is done at irregular intervals, but primarily at the beginning of a game or immediately after expanding. It's also done on an as-needed basis. Proton Charge needs to be cast every X seconds for maximum efficiency. That just screams monotony.

And the argument "Don't like it, don't do it" is superfluous and people need to stop using it. If you choose to play the game and have fun then fine, only build 5 workers at each base and prepare yourself for a war of attrition (with a high probability of failure). But I'd wager 95% of the people who play SC2 will be doing so with the goal of winning. That being said, casting Proton Charge at regular intervals will become a standardized task that is compulsory to success. The only choice in the matter is when you decided to build that Obelisk, after which the endless task is laid out for you.

Not sure why people are arguing for this mechanic, but personally I want to win when I play SC2...and the thought of having to do something every X seconds sickens me. Especially after playing the game for years.

[ArcherofAiur]

You can't compare the two. Building workers is done at irregular intervals, but primarily at the beginning of a game or immediately after expanding.

That doesnt sound at all like what your supposed to do for the first 15 minutes. Cutting probes aside (which is very limited) your supposed to make them every 30 seconds.

[Blazur]

your supposed to make them every 30 seconds.

...on an as-needed basis, until your worker line is saturated.

Proton Charge needs to be done constantly, after every X seconds, for the rest of your career spent playing SC2! Just let that sink in for a bit, and then tell us WHY you're advocating for Proton Charge as it stands currently?

[ArcherofAiur]

im not blanket advocating for proton charge.

Ok so your saying you do it until your worker line is saturated. So when do you think that is? Keep in mind things like probe transfers. Also keep in mind that even if you have a mineral line saturated you still want to use your nexus to make probes for new expansions.

[lipebra]

Just simple, make the obelisk begin full of energy, and the energy regen very slow.limit one per player.

That way u ll be choosing betwen an early econ boost, for a rush or early expo, but ll loose because u r not saturated, or a late boost when u r saturated.

[Skyze]

um.. Thats like saying "Why make probes anymore, if they are forcing us to make probes, screw that"..

You dont HAVE to make probes, you can mine with the first 4 you get (or 6 in sc2 i think?) but if you want to have a better chance at winning, you make more.. Same as Proton charge.

I dont understand what your issue with it is, its not that huge of an advantage anyways if people don't use it I bet. Bisu or any good protoss would still beat you easily without using it while you use it constantly.