Opinions and effectiveness of Medivac?

[RamiZ]

Again, the Protoss and the Zerg have multiple mobility mechanism. The Terrans only get one. Medivacs should be cheap and spammable.

What do you mean by multiple? If you think about transporters like Overlords and Warp Prisms, you need for both those mechanism transporters so I wouldnt say that there is multiple choices.

[Iceman_jkh]

Medivacs hold 4 Marauders, and heal them pretty efficiently. They hold 8 Marines, and because of their lower HP, are able to heal all 8 at a similar rate.

Not entirely comparable. Medivacs can only heal 1 unit at a time (unless something has changed), therefore, while the DPS healing rate would be the same for the Marauder ball as the Maraine Ball, the medivac can only support the same number of units as there are medivacs. (IE: 3 medivacs = only 3 infantry being healed at a time.)

And? Sounds like some number tweaking to me.

If we assume that this is true, why is that a problem? You wouldn't send 16 Marines out with a measly 2 Medics. Having extra transport capacity encourages things like adding a few Hellions to the mix.

According to what I said before (1:5+), you would send out 3-4. Agreed, 2 is too few.

Basically, this comes down to the fact that Medivacs can only heal 1 unit at a time, therefore, you need 1 medivac per unit you want actively supported.

[Nicol Bolas]

What do you mean by multiple? If you think about transporters like Overlords and Warp Prisms, you need for both those mechanism transporters so I wouldnt say that there is multiple choices.

Multiple. More than one.

Zerg have Overlords transport and Nydus. Protoss have Warp Prism transport and Warp-In. Terrans have Medivacs.

The Zerg choose one, the other, or both. One requires research, the other requires a building (+100 minerals per exit). Both can happen at approximately the same time. They have their advantages and disadvantages (people seriously need to use Overlord + Baneling more. Or at all. There's no reason why that shouldn't murder Terran Infantry).

The Protoss don't get anything a reasonable person would call a choice. Protoss are going to use Warp-In, period. Any skilled Protoss player will be using it. So the only choice a Protoss player has is whether they want to use a Warp Prism. That still constitutes a choice.

Terrans have Medivacs. That's it: nothing more. No choices, no decision making, you build this one unit and use it.

I think that the Dropship should be able to be upgraded (per-unit) to Medevac, and that's when the problems end. If you don't need the healing, you don't pay for it.

That basically assumes that a Medivac deserves to cost 100 gas. There's no legitimate argument for why a Warp Prism deserves to cost 0 gas while a Medivac costs 100. Warp Prisms are far superior and game changing compared to Medivacs.

[Pandonetho]

I don't understand how it is you're trying to rationalize StarCraft.

Transports in StarCraft can survive multiple direct hits by anti-air turrets, balls of glowing plasma, and whatever the hell Spore Colonies shoot. A man-portable missile isn't even going to scratch the paint.

The simple fact that air units can only be attacked by certain units shows that, in StarCraft, hitting and damaging flying things is not trivial.

You should just stay out of the conversation because anything involving realism immediately turns you into a retard. Did you not watch the SC: Ghost cinematic where 1 mutalisk glaive wurm that does NINE DAMAGE in game takes down a friggen Dropship, as well as forcing it to crash into another one?

Medics used glowing beams of light just like Med-evacs. Except they were used at melee range rather than from afar.

Don't give me this bullshit. I see you've decided to just ignore the fact that canon lore has medics using on sight surgical tools, and instead just go by gameplay "oh they use a magic beam of light, when instead really marines should be lying on the floor while medics pull out medical tools the size of 2 pixels."

[Aldrius]

Don't give me this bullshit. I see you've decided to just ignore the fact that cannon lore has medics using on sight surgical tools, and instead just go by gameplay "oh they use a magic beam of light, when instead really marines should be lying on the floor while medics pull out medical tools the size of 2 pixels."

Uh, kay... I haven't read the manual in forever.

So how do you know the Med-evac isn't flinging medical tools at the infantry then?

[Nicol Bolas]

You should just stay out of the conversation because anything involving realism immediately turns you into a retard. Did you not watch the SC: Ghost cinematic where 1 mutalisk glaive wurm that does NINE DAMAGE in game takes down a friggen Dropship, as well as forcing it to crash into another one?

You mentioned StarCraft Ghost, a fictional production (never finished, btw) as an aid to realism. And I'm the retard.

And of course, there's the simple fact that you're against a mechanic because it doesn't work in this "realistic" version of StarCraft, yet works perfectly fine in the actual game.

Don't give me this bullshit. I see you've decided to just ignore the fact that cannon lore has medics using on sight surgical tools, and instead just go by gameplay "oh they use a magic beam of light, when instead really marines should be lying on the floor while medics pull out medical tools the size of 2 pixels."

So you're saying that in gameplay, "glowing lights" can equate to the lore equivalent of "surgical tools". Thus when the gameplay shows Medics healing Marines while those Marines are in active combat, that's clearly not actually happening. Instead, the Marines run out, shoot people, get beat up, run back to "cover", and get stitched together.

So if gameplay and lore are already so completely separated, what's your problem with the Medivac? Why can't the "glowing beam from hovering Medivac" in gameplay equate to a lore description of "units picked up and checked into a mobile field hospital?" We've already established that the gameplay and the lore don't have to match in any way, shape, or form, so what's wrong with that solution?

[MattII]

Well I'll just say, as a personal preference, I don't like the fact that it's a flyer that's got the ability, I'd much rather it be a ground unit (of any description).

[Iceman_jkh]

If it can drop a unit at moments notice, its obviously flying at semi low altitude. With that in mind, there's no reason that it wouldnt be within 50metres of the target. Perhaps all infantry suits were specially built with a 'lockon' device inside, so the medivac tractor beam (paladin beam) locks on, then via that special tractor beam, it conducts the repair/healing. Perhaps it modulates the treatment down the beam in order to repair/heal the infantry, or uses semi teleportation (internal to the tractor beam field). Who really cares. There really is nothing about the healing mechanic that is 'unbelieveable' if you compare it with other things we are being asked to believe in the SC universe. Can we please move past this.

[Pandonetho]

You mentioned StarCraft Ghost, a fictional production (never finished, btw) as an aid to realism. And I'm the retard.

Your point? Because there is lore straight from the game that's in books (like a weapon for example) that's canon. Also, you're being a douchebag. So because it got canned, the cinematic which came from the game isn't canon anymore? You're saying that because a mutalisk shotdown a dropship in cinematic for a cancelled game, that's it's not canon? Great, you're a genius, I saw plenty of "ghost only" stuff in that cinematic, such as dropships, and mutalisks and marines and goliaths, so because the game got cancelled that shit isn't canon. /sarcasm, give me a break retard.

And of course, there's the simple fact that you're against a mechanic because it doesn't work in this "realistic" version of StarCraft, yet works perfectly fine in the actual game.

Who said I'm against the mechanic? I just have the complaint that the unit is not realistic, and don't bother going into the long gameplay bullshit again.

So you're saying that in gameplay, "glowing lights" can equate to the lore equivalent of "surgical tools". Thus when the gameplay shows Medics healing Marines while those Marines are in active combat, that's clearly not actually happening. Instead, the Marines run out, shoot people, get beat up, run back to "cover", and get stitched together.

Yes, in fact this is what they do. So are you saying that a battlecruiser is the size of 5 marines just because the gameplay has it that way? Are you really this moronic to be arguing about this?

So if gameplay and lore are already so completely separated, what's your problem with the Medivac? Why can't the "glowing beam from hovering Medivac" in gameplay equate to a lore description of "units picked up and checked into a mobile field hospital?" We've already established that the gameplay and the lore don't have to match in any way, shape, or form, so what's wrong with that solution?

Um, NOTHING? Did I complain about wanting to bring back the medic? You're just an annoying ass guy who likes to come in without comprehending everything. I said that it's an unrealistic unit, if it really does shoot healing beams I'll be disappointed if that's the lore explanation for it instead of them actually lowering down to the ground to provide medical attention.

There really is nothing about the healing mechanic that is 'unbelieveable' if you compare it with other things we are being asked to believe in the SC universe. Can we please move past this.

Yet another forum noob. Why are there so many of you. Do you have an issue with the discussion at hand? If not, screw off.

Why don't you get over the fact that there can be 4-5 medivacs? Is that a problem for you? Get over it.

[Iceman_jkh]

Yet another forum noob. Why are there so many of you. Do you have an issue with the discussion at hand? If not, screw off.

Why don't you get over the fact that there can be 4-5 medivacs? Is that a problem for you? Get over it.

Here's an idea: Read the f*cking thread title! It doesnt say, "whinge about medivac lore/realism". Perhaps it's you who should 'screw off'.

Funnily enough, the thread is for the discussion of medivac effectiveness -something which covers how many medivacs you would need in order to be effective. I'd rather be called a noob, than act like you, a professional keyboard warrior douche... or should I say d00ch3