What if BNET gave silver level players diamond level coaches automatically?
Okay, what if there was a system that used Bnet2.0 matchmaking to assign a "coach" to lower level players.
The system would work as follows:
1. Players from bronze to gold league will have a new button in the BNET interface: "Play a Coached Game" or "Coached 1v1" or a checkbox marked "Coached" near their 1v1 button.
2. When players get promoted to Platinum and Diamond league they would then have a different button: "Coach a Game". They can also choose what race coach.
3. Games would work like a 2v2, low level players are teamed up with a high level players.
4. Only the lower level player controls units and plays 1v1 with other low level players. The higher level player may only send chat messages to his lower level teammate and ping the map.
I got the idea from Gran Tourismo. Basically for lower level players, its just an option for improving their game and for higher level players it would sort of be a B-Spec mode for SC2.
Thoughts?
Re: What if BNET gave silver level players diamond level coaches automatically?
It would be cool, although I think that there will be a lot more students applying for games then mentors. People who are generally considered as "good" usually get that way because they practice a lot and work on specific match ups. Strangely in Sc2, you lose your edge if you don't play often. Meaning that good players need to spend lots of time refining their own game, rather then spending their potentially limited time helping complete strangers.
Helping your friends is one thing, because that is what you do for friends. But complete random strangers? Many people would be leery of that IMO. Of course there will always be truly altruistic people that will help just because of it, but those will be few and far between.
Perhaps some sort of achievement or shout out on the blizzard official site to coaches who help out the most? Kind of like the top 200, but for the top 200 helpers? Who knows, but some incentive to get others to help would definitely increase the number of coaches.
Its a cool idea, I'm just not sure if many would be willing to give up their fun or practice time to help out a random stranger who might not be all that appreciative. Could work though, might be nice to see...
Re: What if BNET gave silver level players diamond level coaches automatically?
dont think ppl will care enough to actually coach random unknowned ppl for no reason... and i can see a bunch of very silly ppl giving very false info when they are coaching
Re: What if BNET gave silver level players diamond level coaches automatically?
Winning 5 qualification maps does not qualify you to coach.
Re: What if BNET gave silver level players diamond level coaches automatically?
Good idea but i doubt blizzard would put this in their matchmaking. Funny that you mention this because our clan did this exact same thing during our practice awhile back. If you need a coach check out The Art of Warfare at TAW.net a lot of ppl their are more than willing to coach.
Re: What if BNET gave silver level players diamond level coaches automatically?
It's a neat idea but it wouldn't work in practice, for reasons including ones already stated. The other is that it simply wouldn't work.
One reason why helping your friends works is that you can (usually) do it over their shoulder, talking to them. Talking is important, because it's loud and it's invasive. Chat on the screen is easy to ignore, especially if the player is flustered because everything is going wrong (usually when someone would be tempted to give advice).
When I'm standing over a buddy's shoulder helping him improve his game, I get a feel from seeing his responses, or lack thereof, if I've explained to him why doing X or Y is a good idea, or if I should keep talking until he understands. If something happens quickly, I can adapt. What's a pro going to do when he's restricted by in-game chat? "OK, now build 2 Factories and a Starport so you can dual pump Siege Tanks and get a Medivac for transp-- oh shit he has Banelings coming into your base raise those supply depots!! Pump out Marines from everything you have!! Get those SCVs from the mineral line to repair!"
See how that just doesn't work? You can't respond as effectively online as you can live, and the low-level player isn't likely to pick up on most of the advice anyway. It just wouldn't be an effective method of teaching people, I think. Instead it would cause both players frustration, one because he can't communicate his advice properly and in time, and the other because he can't follow advice in a way that helps him improve his game in a huge way (because he's not a mind reader).
If anything, I think a "spectate random Diamond-league game" button would work wonders. It would also introduce shittons of lag, so... that's probably why it isn't there already. ;)
Re: What if BNET gave silver level players diamond level coaches automatically?
No lags in my games plox.
Re: What if BNET gave silver level players diamond level coaches automatically?
Also, just because you're Diamond, doesn't automatically mean you're good... There are tiers in Diamond League.
I can easily beat Low and mid diamond. but as soon as I reach like the 30th ranked or 15th ranked ones, I get outmacroed, or out-played. And I am at the top of Platinum. I don't think I want to be coached by someone who I can beat easily, or who is equally skilled to me. If anything, an equally skilled player would still teach me a few things about my own mechanics, but nothing new in terms of real strategy or timing of a build, or of an attack.
The real coaches would have to be top 1500+ point diamonds. But then, unless they're your friend, I don't feel they would be willing to sacrifice their valuable ladder time to teach a noob.
Because honestly speaking, that's what I am. A slightly experienced noob, but a noob nonetheless.
Re: What if BNET gave silver level players diamond level coaches automatically?
Sounds unnecessary considering all of the other features they should be focusing on before a thing such as this.
Just ask someone you play that beats you for advice. Many (like myself) will often play a few games with someone if they ask just to let them know what they did wrong. Or at least chat for a while before destroying their base or them leaving to explain how they mismanaged. Likewise, this has worked for me too when I lose. I often ask what build the other player went and what they think I should have done. I've received some pretty good advice on occasion from friendlier players.
Re: What if BNET gave silver level players diamond level coaches automatically?
Wookie, i think you should read the OP completely before giving your opinion. The Diamond players wouldn't play against the low-level players.
Re: What if BNET gave silver level players diamond level coaches automatically?
Re: What if BNET gave silver level players diamond level coaches automatically?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ooZer0
Strangely in Sc2, you lose your edge if you don't play often.
I agree wholeheartedly. And it doesn't take long either. I was ballin' (vocab thx 2 Husky) in 1v1s and 2v2s Sunday night after getting a gold in the Rush Defense challenge that afternoon, then came back Monday night and lost a step on my early macro. Got it back Tuesday night after a few games, slid a little Wednesday night, but picked up again after a few games. Haven't played since. Tonight should be fun. :)
Quote:
Originally Posted by
protoswarrior
Also, just because you're Diamond, doesn't automatically mean you're good... There are tiers in Diamond League.
I can easily beat Low and mid diamond. but as soon as I reach like the 30th ranked or 15th ranked ones, I get outmacroed, or out-played. And I am at the top of Platinum. I don't think I want to be coached by someone who I can beat easily, or who is equally skilled to me. If anything, an equally skilled player would still teach me a few things about my own mechanics, but nothing new in terms of real strategy or timing of a build, or of an attack.
The real coaches would have to be top 1500+ point diamonds. But then, unless they're your friend, I don't feel they would be willing to sacrifice their valuable ladder time to teach a noob.
Because honestly speaking, that's what I am. A slightly experienced noob, but a noob nonetheless.
Good points! This is visible in Bronze as well, and is likely true at all levels. I've been as high as #10 in my league and then get hammered by mostly better players, the occasionally well-executed proxy pylon or Rax cheese excluded. To tie-in my above comment about 00Zero's post, my early macro has improved greatly with practice, but these upper Bronzes (I assume) still get me. I just have to get a scout out more often when I'm not favored. I usually forgo it when I know where my opponent is, to my detriment at times, but not always. I'm working on an early Marine/Zealot/Ling scout to make up for the econ choice. :)
This said, I agree with Protoss Warrior and those who say the skill level is not as uniform as the league designation would imply. Simply choosing Plat and Diamond tutors would not entirely be appropriate. I am a Bronze who has helped other Bronzes with tips and tactics. It's like a friend and I agreed on Wednesday: we know the tricks but have to work on our execution of them.
Re: What if BNET gave silver level players diamond level coaches automatically?
give the coaches a percentage of the earned ladder points. That'll get people to help for sure.
I personaly wouldn't mind at all coaching someone in the bronze/silver leagues. Good idea!
Re: What if BNET gave silver level players diamond level coaches automatically?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Carsickness
give the coaches a percentage of the earned ladder points. That'll get people to help for sure.
I personaly wouldn't mind at all coaching someone in the bronze/silver leagues. Good idea!
That would defeat the purpose of points. Points are supposed to be earned by winning games you play in.
Maybe they can give different achievements such as new portraits. That would work.
Re: What if BNET gave silver level players diamond level coaches automatically?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Thumper
That would defeat the purpose of points. Points are supposed to be earned by winning games you play in.
Maybe they can give different achievements such as new portraits. That would work.
Yeah. You're telling the guy what to build and why. You may not be pushing buttons, but you definitely are playing.
Maybe it could give you a small amount of bonus points instead?
I can't see anyone helping people out without points as a reward.
Re: What if BNET gave silver level players diamond level coaches automatically?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Carsickness
Yeah. You're telling the guy what to build and why. You may not be pushing buttons, but you definitely are playing.
Maybe it could give you a small amount of bonus points instead?
I can't see anyone helping people out without points as a reward.
You arent playing though. You are telling him what to do. Totally different from playing an actual game yourself. They can add points to your character achievements but definitely not for ladder. So I think giving you character achievement points and portraits would be a good idea for such thing.
Re: What if BNET gave silver level players diamond level coaches automatically?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Thumper
You arent playing though. You are telling him what to do. Totally different from playing an actual game yourself. They can add points to your character achievements but definitely not for ladder. So I think giving you character achievement points and portraits would be a good idea for such thing.
Hence why I think bonus points would do better. No one cares about achievment points. I certainly don't. But if helping people directly helped me in the ladder then i would definitely help out the noobs.
Do you think the top 200 players are going to waste there time helping lower league players for a portrait? I think not. Bonus points are a different story though.
Re: What if BNET gave silver level players diamond level coaches automatically?
I think this idea would become valid once group viewing of replays would be possible. Until then, I think it is really not interesting for the said "coach".
Re: What if BNET gave silver level players diamond level coaches automatically?
There's already a dozen different ways to get better at this game. You don't need some diamond kid "teaching" you how to play. Plus, most people in Diamond are bad; they just memorize a couple build orders and spam games. I could teach three good build orders to anyone, get them to perfect it and have them reach top Diamond in a couple months. It's really not that hard.
