enslavers III? MAJOR SPOILER IN THIS THREAD FOR DARK TEMPLAR SAGA: TWLIGHT

after reading the synopsious for dark templar saga: twlight (major spolier)

Hidden Content:

ulerazj gets trapped in a kahalidrin crystal with Zamara. Do any of you think he could be freed and fighting him would the the basis for a mini campaign or an enslavers 3? in starcraft 2 could we see an enslavers 4 or 5 for the expansions?

Also why was there no voice acting in the origonal enslavers?

Voice acting is expensive, and Enslavers was a post-release side campaign that had nothing to do with the main storyline. It didn't need voice acting.

Still waiting for you guys to get used to the "we have more than 1 forum to post in" concept! :D

Moved to SC Universe Lore.

Honestly, I'd rather see Ulrezaj feature in the main storyline. But I bet he'd be in a sidestory; plenty of people who play StarCraft II won't have read the Dark Templar Saga.

He'd be a PitA to fight in campaign mode. Ow!

Ulrezaj sounds seriously like a total badass and I as well would love to see him be featured in the main campaign. However, this is unlikely as he has hardly anything to do with Terrans (aka the Terran campaign) besides Jake Ramsey and maybe Valerian.

Maybe he'll escape in Legacy of the Void?

EDIT: WARNING, THIS POST MAY CONTAIN MAJOR SPOILERS TO THE THIRD BOOK IN THE DARK TEMPLAR TRILOGY, "TWILIGHT". You have been warned!

It's possible. Remember, the vat creatures? It's alluded that they are Hybrids. Why would Ulrezaj be helping create Hybrids (Which we know now are the Xel'Naga themselves)? Plus, it was mentionned he was trying to access the memories of the Dark Templar...Why? That's another point that isn't explored in DT: Twilight.

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Originally Posted by Alex06

It's possible. Remember, the vat creatures? It's alluded that they are Hybrids. Why would Ulrezaj be helping create Hybrids (Which we know now are the Xel'Naga themselves)?

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He probably knows what Duran and Zamara knew of the xel'naga, and was either trying to recreate them, or prevent their creation. (I don't see how creating hybrids would stop the recreation of the xel'naga, provided there are still some protoss and zerg left alive. Or maybe that was the point.)

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Plus, it was mentionned he was trying to access the memories of the Dark Templar...Why? That's another point that isn't explored in DT: Twilight.

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Dunno what was so dangerous in those memories, but he did access them. He used those memories to turn himself into a very powerful, long-lasting dark archon. I wish we knew his component personalities.

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Originally Posted by Alex06

EDIT: WARNING, THIS POST MAY CONTAIN MAJOR SPOILERS TO THE THIRD BOOK IN THE DARK TEMPLAR TRILOGY, "TWILIGHT". You have been warned!

It's possible. Remember, the vat creatures? It's alluded that they are Hybrids. Why would Ulrezaj be helping create Hybrids (Which we know now are the Xel'Naga themselves)? Plus, it was mentionned he was trying to access the memories of the Dark Templar...Why? That's another point that isn't explored in DT: Twilight.

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SPOILER WARNING


The creatures in the vats are not Xel'naga. Hybrids, yes, but not Xel'naga. They're an imitation more than anything. Artificial and created outside the regular Xel'naga cycle.

From the book, page 217: (MAJOR SPOILER!)

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His Stomach churned. "Those . . . whatever they were . . . that's the new Xel'Naga? A genetic combination of Protoss and Zerg?"
"NO", Zamara answered swiftly, and Jake closed his eyes in relief. "No. Those---things---are truly abominations. There is nothing in them of the natural cycle of the Xel'Naga. I grieve for the protoss who were so violated. The Xel'Naga are implacable in their way, but not to that extreme. What you saw, Zeratul, and what perhaps we also beheld inthe caverns is something else entirely. Something very wrong, something that should not be."

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EDIT: I think the intent of the hybrids is to interfere with the cycle. The Xel'Naga don't appear to be necessarily malevolent. It's a cycle that's been reoccurring countless times. The Zerg weren't meant to attack and destroy the Xel'Naga fleets. Something apparently interfered. The hybrids will be the malevolent force in the trilogy, rather than the Xel'naga.... maybe

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Originally Posted by AvixK7

SPOILER WARNING


The creatures in the vats are NOT Xel'naga. Hybrids, yes, but not Xel'naga. They're an imitation more than anything. Artificial and created outside the regular Xel'naga cycle.

From the book, page 217: (MAJOR SPOILER!)

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Hmm...So maybe that means that Duran and Ulrezaj are trying to recreate the Xel'Naga, but that they were not affiliated with the Xel'Naga themselves...Why would they need to create the Xel'Naga, then?

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Originally Posted by Alex06

Hmm...So maybe that means that Duran and Ulrezaj are trying to recreate the Xel'Naga, but that they were not affiliated with the Xel'Naga themselves...Why would they need to create the Xel'Naga, then?

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... ULTIMATE POWER!!!!!! MUHHAHAHA!!!.....

seriously, I dunno. Jealously, rivalry, reverence, misplaced enthusiasm.....

EDIT: I like the fact that all this time we were led to believe that the Xel'Naga were the upcoming villains, but turns out is another faction altogether, separate from the Xel'naga, but linked in some form.

I'm curious where Kerrigan's part is gonna play in all this.

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Originally Posted by AvixK7

EDIT: I think the intent of the hybrids is to interfere with the cycle. The Xel'Naga don't appear to be necessarily malevolent. It's a cycle that's been reoccurring countless times. The Zerg weren't meant to attack and destroy the Xel'Naga fleets. Something apparently interfered. The hybrids will be the malevolent force in the trilogy, rather than the Xel'naga.... maybe

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But then, remember what Zeratul tells Raynor in the campaign preview we've seen before:
"James Raynor."
"Zeratul..."
"I bring tidings of doom...
The Xel'Naga return.
The cycle nears its end...
The artifacts are the key-"
"The key? The key to what?"
"To the end of all things."

It implies that they are the Xel'Naga, and not a copy...
Perhaps the Hybrids are nothing but a gross copy of the Xel'Naga, but with the artifacts (whatever they are), they can become the actual Xel'Naga.

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Originally Posted by Alex06

But then, remember what Zeratul tells Raynor in the campaign preview we've seen before:
"James Raynor."
"Zeratul..."
"I bring tidings of doom...
The Xel'Naga return.
The cycle nears its end...
The artifacts are the key-"
"The key? The key to what?"
"To the end of all things."

It implies that they are the Xel'Naga, and not a copy...
Perhaps the Hybrids are nothing but a gross copy of the Xel'Naga, but with the artifacts (whatever they are), they can become the actual Xel'Naga.

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Perhaps Blizzard didn't have the storyline completely fleshed out yet?

This is interesting; people had always suggested the Hybrids were the same as the Xel'Naga, but they still wrong in a way.

On the topic of an Enslavers III, it's possible. It might even be the mini-campaign that Blizzard keeps telling us about. Instead of following Ulrezaj, it follows Zeratul to the meeting of the energy creatures.

Speaking of the energy creatures, do we still not know what they are?

I just thought of something. It's mentioned that the Hybrids are not the Xel'Naga exactly, but a peversion of what they should be. How is this the case? The Zerg and the Protoss can still join together, but what makes it a perversion now?

I was thinking it could be that the Zerg assimilated that era's Xel'Naga. At that point it wouldn't just be the Zerg and Protoss, but also the Xel'Naga themselves going into the new Xel'Naga, which could have unforseen consequences.

It could also be that the Zerg have assimilated so many different creatures that, despite what both Duran and the Overmind believe, they no longer have purity of essence. Going into these new 'Xel'Naga' would not just be Zerg and Protoss, but also Terran, Brontolith, Arachnis, and everything else the Zerg had ever assimilated, which like the assimilated Xel'Naga scenario could seriously screw up the hybridization process.

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Originally Posted by Alex06

Hmm...So maybe that means that Duran and Ulrezaj are trying to recreate the Xel'Naga, but that they were not affiliated with the Xel'Naga themselves...Why would they need to create the Xel'Naga, then?

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Duran does seem affiliated with them. He claims to serve them. (Given what we know of the xel'naga cycle now, I don't think he could be talking about anything else.)

I think some xel'naga survived, long enough to make the xel'naga temple of Shakuras (revenge-seeking bug zapper) and teach/co-opt Duran. However, the remainder could have died of old age by now, leaving Duran behind to do things without xel'naga oversight. He could be doing things wrong, perhaps due to simple impatience. It seems his current plot only started when he learned of Kerrigan being successfully infested.

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Originally Posted by Muspelli

I just thought of something. It's mentioned that the Hybrids are not the Xel'Naga exactly, but a peversion of what they should be. How is this the case? The Zerg and the Protoss can still join together, but what makes it a perversion now?

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I think the type of joining needs to be natural, over eons, rather than "mix the DNA goop together".

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Speaking of the energy creatures, do we still not know what they are?

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No, but we know what they're used for.

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Originally Posted by Kimera757

Duran does seem affiliated with them. He claims to serve them. (Given what we know of the xel'naga cycle now, I don't think he could be talking about anything else.)

I think some xel'naga survived, long enough to make the xel'naga temple of Shakuras (revenge-seeking bug zapper) and teach/co-opt Duran. However, the remainder could have died of old age by now, leaving Duran behind to do things without xel'naga oversight. He could be doing things wrong, perhaps due to simple impatience. It seems his current plot only started when he learned of Kerrigan being successfully infested.



I think the type of joining needs to be natural, over eons, rather than "mix the DNA goop together".



No, but we know what they're used for.

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This makes me think...Perhaps Duran is an Energy creature? We've seen them absorb DNA, and perhaps less complex DNA such as human DNA can be easily reproduced, thus he was able to take a human form?

Reminds me of the aliens from 2008's TDTESS or The Knowing...

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Originally Posted by Alex06

But then, remember what Zeratul tells Raynor in the campaign preview we've seen before:
"James Raynor."
"Zeratul..."
"I bring tidings of doom...
The Xel'Naga return.
The cycle nears its end...
The artifacts are the key-"
"The key? The key to what?"
"To the end of all things."

It implies that they are the Xel'Naga, and not a copy...
Perhaps the Hybrids are nothing but a gross copy of the Xel'Naga, but with the artifacts (whatever they are), they can become the actual Xel'Naga.

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Good point. it's all a little perplexing really :) this is gonna be fun once it's out.

Hybrids =/= Xel'Naga. It makes little sense, and is not an interesting tidbit.

Think of it this way. Super smart scientists playing god try to create the perfect race. They experiment on this primitive race that has psychic potential and allow them to tap into a higher conciousness. Later on they create a race that is highly adaptable to its environment, incredibly resilient and resourceful.

Somehow the two creations merge together and create... The scientists? Makes no friggin sense period. Yes, I know biblical references of 'god creating beings in his own image' but I don't think the Xel'Naga were in it to forge other races into their own shape. I highly doubt they would plan something like merging two incredibly different species to create themselves.

The only possibility I see of that working is if they threw in some random time-paradox shit where the Xel'Naga are hybrids in the far future who went back in time to create their own existence - a paradox I would NOT want to see in the SC universe.

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Originally Posted by Triceron

Hybrids =/= Xel'Naga. It makes little sense, and is not an interesting tidbit.

Think of it this way. Super smart scientists playing god try to create the perfect race. They experiment on this primitive race that has psychic potential and allow them to tap into a higher conciousness. Later on they create a race that is highly adaptable to its environment, incredibly resilient and resourceful.

Somehow the two creations merge together and create... The scientists? Makes no friggin sense period. Yes, I know biblical references of 'god creating beings in his own image' but I don't think the Xel'Naga were in it to forge other races into their own shape. I highly doubt they would plan something like merging two incredibly different species to create themselves.

The only possibility I see of that working is if they threw in some random time-paradox shit where the Xel'Naga are hybrids in the far future who went back in time to create their own existence - a paradox I would NOT want to see in the SC universe.

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Agreed. What was wrong with the Xel'Naga just being wacky scientists who played God? Why do they have to be gods? StarCraft has never been dependent on it's villains being demi-god like beings before.

I mean maybe if after a while the Xel'Naga's DNA begins to deteriorate and that makes them weak and helpless and they need to make more to create new Xel'Naga or something, then I could make sense of that, but that just sounds even more complicated than them just being crazy scientists who were crappy in battle.

Who knows? It's a sci-fi video game. :P

It could very well be that purity of essence and purity of form together can only make the Xel'Naga...Like 2+3 can only make 5. Doesn't matter if you add 1+4, either, as long as the final result is 5.

I don't think they literally recreate themselvs; I think they create something that reflects themselves. What makes something Xel'Naga is both purity of form and essence in the same entity, as Alex said.

They're not god-like entities that literally form again when the unification occurs, they're simply two concepts merged together. I suspect that each incarnation has little to no knowledge of the previous ones, or at least that they are the same thing, nor do they even resemble the previous incarnations physically.

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Originally Posted by Muspelli

I don't think they literally recreate themselvs; I think they create something that reflects themselves. What makes something Xel'Naga is both purity of form and essence in the same entity, as Alex said.

They're not god-like entities that literally form again when the unification occurs, they're simply two concepts merged together. I suspect that each incarnation has little to no knowledge of the previous ones, or at least that they are the same thing, nor do they even resemble the previous incarnations physically.

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Logic would have it this way, but for some reason, I expect Blizzard to say instead that they recreate themselves exactly the same...Which would be a shame, TBH.

EDIT: It makes me wonder if the energy creatures aren't the Xel'Naga themselves...Hmm...Nah, because then the Protoss would recognize them as Xel'Naga...But then again, the only Protoss that has apparently seen the energy creatures is Zeratul, and he probably doesn't know what they look like since he's not a Khalai...

And if the Xel'Naga didn't know of the cycle (which would make sense, considering how the Protoss and Zerg backstories were explained in the SC manual), how does Zamara know? (Especially since apparently other Protoss don't seem to know...) And how do Duran and Ulrezaj know of the cycle? Did someone warn Ulrezaj, or did he discover it when accessing the DT memory archives that we see in DT: Twilight? If so, how come that no one else knows except him?

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Originally Posted by Alex06

EDIT: It makes me wonder if the energy creatures aren't the Xel'Naga themselves

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They aren't. While they're powerful, they're tools.

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And if the Xel'Naga didn't know of the cycle (which would make sense, considering how the Protoss and Zerg backstories were explained in the SC manual)

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They knew of the cycle. That's why they were so desperate to find species with purity of form and essence - indeed, Zamara makes this exact point. I think they went overboard with the protoss. At first, the protoss seemed to have purity of essence as well, which would have made a great short-cut, but they didn't keep their purity of essence for long. And then the zerg ate them.

(Except why seem surprised at the purity of essence? Retcon? Or were they just surprised to see a species with both?)

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how does Zamara know? (Especially since apparently other Protoss don't seem to know...)

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The protoss love to keep secrets. I suspect some protoss before the Aeon of Strife knew (and she has their memories), or she scanned Khas' direct memories (he got a lot of knowledge from the xel'naga AI; he didn't have to spread everything he knew).

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And how do Duran and Ulrezaj know of the cycle? Did someone warn Ulrezaj, or did he discover it when accessing the DT memory archives that we see in DT: Twilight? If so, how come that no one else knows except him?

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The latter, probably, and very few Dark Templar get to look at the Wall of Knowledge. Even the "head keeper" doesn't know everything stored there.

Edit: The origin story makes me wonder if this picture is really of them: http://www.starcraft2.com/art.xml?s=43

Anyone have any ideas as to who Duran's masters are? I've been thinking of it for a while and am completely stumped.

He says the higher power he serves has been asleep for countless ages, and is reflected by the hybrid. Sounds a lot like the xel'naga, although (quite possibly) he hasn't ever met one, and just knows a lot about them (the way Ulrezaj and Zamara did).

If he's been alive for thousands of years though, one wonders why he hasn't noticed the flaw. Or maybe Zamara's wrong. Since he might never have actually spoken to a xel'naga, they couldn't tell him he's doing things the wrong way. Then again, maybe he serves some few surviving desperate xel'naga which figure a hybrid is better than not having any xel'naga at all.

Damnit, I went to Coles yesterday at my local mall and they still don't have it yet.

I think the only places so far that have the book in my area are the Chapters (bigger book stores).

Don't bother blindly shopping. If you visit chapters.indigo.ca (I noticed you're Canadian), you can use their store lookup tool. Note, once you start seeing books there, wait two days, as they take a long time to shelve books.

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Originally Posted by Kimera757

He says the higher power he serves has been asleep for countless ages, and is reflected by the hybrid. Sounds a lot like the xel'naga, although (quite possibly) he hasn't ever met one, and just knows a lot about them (the way Ulrezaj and Zamara did).

If he's been alive for thousands of years though, one wonders why he hasn't noticed the flaw. Or maybe Zamara's wrong. Since he might never have actually spoken to a xel'naga, they couldn't tell him he's doing things the wrong way. Then again, maybe he serves some few surviving desperate xel'naga which figure a hybrid is better than not having any xel'naga at all.

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Makes sense.

I would imagine some surviving Xel'Naga would be offended by the hybrids, in the same way everyone else seems to be, but I can imagine some would rather exist in some form, albeit a twisted one.

Zamara might be wrong, too. That's interesting. Perhaps these hybrids would be proper Xel'Naga; I still believe that purity of form and essence make something Xel'Naga, even if the creature differs greatly from the previous ones. Even while these ones are actually painful to be around (at least the ones Ulrezaj was making, assuming they were hybrids), and the protoss look upon them as abominations, perhaps they are just as the old Xel'Naga intended, however twisted they are in the eyes of everyone else.

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Originally Posted by Muspelli

I don't think they literally recreate themselvs; I think they create something that reflects themselves. What makes something Xel'Naga is both purity of form and essence in the same entity, as Alex said.

They're not god-like entities that literally form again when the unification occurs, they're simply two concepts merged together. I suspect that each incarnation has little to no knowledge of the previous ones, or at least that they are the same thing, nor do they even resemble the previous incarnations physically.

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Yes, maybe Xel'Naga should be considered a sort of legacy and not a race per se.

Does anyone know the origin of the name. The only thing I could come up with is "those of serpentine origin". ;p

Wanderers from Afar (according to the manual), but I think Firstborn has a different meaning for that.

Of the xel'naga, Zamara said they are not monsters.

Zeratul has said strange things about the xel'naga. In the opening video:

"The Zerg Swarm came as was foretold. And the protoss, firstborn of the gods, rose to fight them. Now, the xel'naga that forged us all are returning. But do they come to save... or to destroy?"

And later:

"I bring tidings of doom. The xel'naga return, the cycle nears its end, the artifacts are the key... to the end of all things."

Is he talking about the xel'naga, or the hybrids? Does he distinguish between them at this point?

I figure Duran (or whomever he serves, if he is indeed a pawn) is a rogue Xel'naga. who's to say that they aren't corruptible? He wants a legion of his own people to conquer the universe. The only problem being is that the rest of his race would not cooperate with him. Solution? mess with the genetics involved, entice the Overmind into eliminating his peers, and raise your collective genetic freak kids to dominion over all creation. The Xel'naga are indeed returning, but not as they once were.

EDIT: Warcraft brought me another solution, though its not particularly original for blizzard if they reuse it. The titans, seeing that the old gods are breaking loose would have destroyed all of azeroth to stop it, if the raid does not defeat alganon. Maybe the true Xel'naga would do that on a galactic scale to stop Duran, Ulrejaz and co. from unleashing the hybrids.

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Originally Posted by Hewhoendures

I figure Duran (or whomever he serves, if he is indeed a pawn) is a rogue Xel'naga. who's to say that they aren't corruptible? He wants a legion of his own people to conquer the universe. The only problem being is that the rest of his race would not cooperate with him. Solution? mess with the genetics involved, entice the Overmind into eliminating his peers, and raise your collective genetic freak kids to dominion over all creation. The Xel'naga are indeed returning, but not as they once were.

EDIT: Warcraft brought me another solution, though its not particularly original for blizzard if they reuse it. The titans, seeing that the old gods are breaking loose would have destroyed all of azeroth to stop it, if the raid does not defeat alganon. Maybe the true Xel'naga would do that on a galactic scale to stop Duran, Ulrejaz and co. from unleashing the hybrids.

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I'm guessing that Duran and the Energy beings are of the same race, but Duran absorbed human DNA to "infiltrate" the Koprulu sector...

Your second hypothesis seems more believable...

My guess is that The Energy Creatures, are part of the true Xel'nagas real plan, and are pretty much gatherers, they do not seem to be intelligent on the level as whatever Duran is. They absorb the Protoss and Zerg energies, and take them.... somewhere. Duran and Ulrezaj, are without them and thus resorting to directly capturing the genetic material.

the Xel'naga have a millennia of experience of doing this, hence the great cosmic cycle. that is why i think the Overmind's 'rebellion' was not just its own doing but a Xanatos gambit by someone among the Xel'naga. Think about it, if your race has been doing this over and over, and millions of years in between to refine that process, how would there be any chance of your test subjects actually getting out of hand and destroying you without outside interference? The Overmind's plan to infest the Protoss certainly fits with the hybrid experiment, its death at the hands of Tassadar was a setback and forced Duran to manipulate Kerrigan personally to get what he needed as he wouldn't be directly in control of the swarm. Kerrigan likely doesn't know or care about the Overminds goals. and the Overmind itself wasn't likely to reveal any of the grand plan to what are essentially unquestioning slaves. the fact that this plan is taking thousands upon thousands of years means little to one of such a lifespan as a Xel'naga.

Since nobody reads the news forum, I'll just copy/pasta my posts into here:

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Adun returning, this will be very interesting if he indeed returns but I think he will most likely return (if he ever does) in Legacy of the Void. Could Tassadar return as well? ohhh the possibilities

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I had a theory that Adun's spirit was reborn in Tassadar. This "Anakh Su'n" then, would be a Protoss who continually taps into both khala & void powers, then disappears, and is reborn again & again to save the Protoss when they need him most.

Some fun facts:
Kerrigan has an organic throne that she sits on.
Tassadar had 50 warpships at Chau Sara, but 100 when he confronted Duke on Mar Sara.

Final questions:
- Is Zamara engaged with an eternal struggle with Ulrezaj inside the crystal? That seems like a cruel fate. It's a crystal - so you'd think that the memories, Zamara & Ulrezaj would simply be downloaded & that's it.

- Since Kerrigan expressed interest in heading towards the caves beneath Aiur, could those caverns be what we see in the Zeratul/Kerrigan cinematic trailer from BlizzCon? "I knew you'd find your way here, eventually..."

- I'm going to assume that Xel'Naga lifespans are thousands & thousands of years then?

- What in the world are those energy creatures? Are they the essence of the Xel'Naga? Locked away for millenia & waiting to take host bodies?

- It was still part of the Xel'Naga's plans for the Protoss to become infested/assimilated then? The two species are supposed to join via their natural evolution and this is the only way I see for them to join that way. So perhaps the Xel'Naga are evil, as far as the Protoss are concerned.

- Why do Hybrids have to be created to prevent Xel'Naga from being reborn? Presumably, the Hybrids fill up a space that would have normally been taken by the Xel'Naga. But the destruction of either Zerg or Protoss would accomplish the same goal. So the Hybrids serve two purposes then? They are being created to be used as both an army to destroy the Zerg/Protoss and to fill the gap the Xel'Naga would fill?

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Originally Posted by Gradius

Since nobody reads the news forum, I'll just copy/pasta my posts into here:

I had a theory that Adun's spirit was reborn in Tassadar. This "Anakh Su'n" then, would be a Protoss who continually taps into both khala & void powers, then disappears, and is reborn again & again to save the Protoss when they need him most.

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Maybe, but if so, lame. I hope neither Adun nor Tassadar come back, especially not Adun!

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Some fun facts:
Kerrigan has an organic throne that she sits on.
Tassadar had 50 warpships at Chau Sara, but 100 when he confronted Duke on Mar Sara.

Final questions:
- Is Zamara engaged with an eternal struggle with Ulrezaj inside the crystal? That seems like a cruel fate. It's a crystal - so you'd think that the memories, Zamara & Ulrezaj would simply be downloaded & that's it.

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No, their actual personalities are there. (It's a pure crystal, not one of the modified ones usually used by the alysaar.) If you tried to access memories, you'd probably end up talking to them, and since Ulrezaj is more powerful, you'd end up talking to him.

In a way, it was a bad move. While Zamara's memories are accessible in a way, she only gave up that one important piece of info, and I'm not sure if anyone other than Ramsey or Zeratul actually know this. (And Ramsey probably told Valerian Mengsk...)

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- Since Kerrigan expressed interest in heading towards the caves beneath Aiur, could those caverns be what we see in the Zeratul/Kerrigan cinematic trailer from BlizzCon? "I knew you'd find your way here, eventually..."

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Now, isn't that an interesting thought? There's no way Kerrigan could have made it to the "interesting planet" faster than Zeratul, so...

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- I'm going to assume that Xel'Naga lifespans are thousands & thousands of years then?

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Yup. (*Cough* Young prodigal. *Cough*)

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- What in the world are those energy creatures? Are they the essence of the Xel'Naga? Locked away for millenia & waiting to take host bodies?

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1) They're organic tools, designed to create that wormhole.
2) Doubtful, since they seemed to sacrifice themselves to create the wormhole. Only one absorbed protoss and zerg DNA; looks like a plotline which Blizzard dropped.
3) Absolutely not! They didn't need host bodies, as they sacrificed themselves.

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- It was still part of the Xel'Naga's plans for the Protoss to become infested/assimilated then?

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Yes.

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The two species are supposed to join via their natural evolution and this is the only way I see for them to join that way.

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Zerg assimilation isn't necessarily "natural" or "proper". Zamara implied this, by saying the zerg killing off the xel'naga would prevent a natural reunion. But we do know the zerg haven't managed to assimilate protoss (except that one-off event in the Creep short story). There was nothing preventing the zerg from going crazy and wiping out all life (as Tassadar put it in the original StarCraft). But this is admittedly a bit theoretical.

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So perhaps the Xel'Naga are evil, as far as the Protoss are concerned.

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Zamara didn't seem to think so, but Zeratul said she was more forgiving.

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- Why do Hybrids have to be created to prevent Xel'Naga from being reborn?

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I think a lot of people misinterpret this part.

I don't think the creation of the hybrids actually prevent the xel'naga from being reborn directly. If the hybrids emerge, they will (according to Tassadar) go nuts, spread throughout the universe and kill everything, including the protoss. (Back to Zamara) Without any protoss left alive, how could the xel'naga be reborn?

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So the Hybrids serve two purposes then? They are being created to be used as both an army to destroy the Zerg/Protoss and to fill the gap the Xel'Naga would fill?

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The xel'naga might have wanted revenge on the zerg (this was my original assumption) but for them to be reborn, the zerg must survive as well. It's possible Duran is a deluded alien, who thinks he's serving the xel'naga (through some gambit similar to what Ulrezaj went through; a little knowledge is dangerous), honestly believing that the hybrids are the next incarnation of the xel'naga. If so, then why should he care if the protoss and zerg are both destroyed, if he believes the xel'naga have already returned?

From the way Zeratul speaks in the BlizzCon videos, however, it seems he does not distinguish between the hybrids and xel'naga (he keeps saying the xel'naga return) and is unsure whether the hybrids will be the nasty horrors everyone thinks they'll be, or whether they'll be benevolent like the xel'naga seemed to have been.

Come to think of it, what part of the xel'naga (other than purity of essence and form) transfer between incarnations? It's like they lose out on a lot of technology and knowledge this way. Do they have some sort of update center? The artifacts maybe? Suppose exposing the hybrids to the artifacts would give them xel'naga memories and cause them to become sane and relatively benevolent ... and if so, selling the artifacts to the Mobius Foundation is not a good idea.

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Originally Posted by Kimera757

No, their actual personalities are there. (It's a pure crystal, not one of the modified ones usually used by the alysaar.) If you tried to access memories, you'd probably end up talking to them, and since Ulrezaj is more powerful, you'd end up talking to him.

In a way, it was a bad move. While Zamara's memories are accessible in a way, she only gave up that one important piece of info, and I'm not sure if anyone other than Ramsey or Zeratul actually know this. (And Ramsey probably told Valerian Mengsk...)

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This is a classic example of the trope Sealed Evil in a Can, the only reason he wasn't destroyed outright is because blizzard may intend to use him later. i hope so, Ulrezaj was a cool and unique bad guy.

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Yes.
Zerg assimilation isn't necessarily "natural" or "proper". Zamara implied this, by saying the zerg killing off the xel'naga would prevent a natural reunion. But we do know the zerg haven't managed to assimilate protoss (except that one-off event in the Creep short story). There was nothing preventing the zerg from going crazy and wiping out all life (as Tassadar put it in the original StarCraft). But this is admittedly a bit theoretical.

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Now here is where i disagree. Zamara literally stated that they were intended to become Xel'naga. The hybrids and most definitely zerg infestation are prime examples of doing it wrong. as zamara put it, they literally put two parts of themselves into two different species, thus making them evolve and combine harmoniously into Xel'naga (remember the zerg would have been radically different race if they were completed by the Xel'naga), not the gene splicing of the Hybrids and the forced assimilation of Infestation. She even says that she is not sure if the protoss as they are now would have been harmed ( i interpreted this as the Xel'naga may just take what they need from each completed species and be on their merry way, instead of complete unification, leaving the rest to evolve into what they will.)

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Come to think of it, what part of the xel'naga (other than purity of essence and form) transfer between incarnations? It's like they lose out on a lot of technology and knowledge this way. Do they have some sort of update center? The artifacts maybe? Suppose exposing the hybrids to the artifacts would give them xel'naga memories and cause them to become sane and relatively benevolent ... and if so, selling the artifacts to the Mobius Foundation is not a good idea.

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Hmm... to have the artifacts become a memory transfer isnt that far fetched of an idea for a species as advanced as the Xel'naga, then again there might also be elder Xel'naga around to literally teach the new generation (or there would have been if not for the zerg.) hell for all we know the Xel'naga could start this breeding life cycle around their 'middle ages' just like humans usually have children before they're completely elderly. However i don't believe the Hybrids are capable of being turned into true Xel'naga, because of the uncompleted strain of Zerg used, as well as the gene splicing, The genetics involved would be (and are) completely out of wack.

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Originally Posted by Hewhoendures

Now here is where i disagree. Zamara literally stated that they were intended to become Xel'naga. The hybrids and most definitely zerg infestation are prime examples of doing it wrong.

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With you so far; that wouldn't be natural.

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as zamara put it, they literally put two parts of themselves into two ifferent species, thus making them evolve and combine harmoniously into Xel'naga (remember the zerg would have been radically different race if they were completed by the Xel'naga)

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This I don't agree with. The xel'naga were happy with the zerg before they got eaten (so says the manual). Zamara didn't say the zerg hadn't been fully evolved either.

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not the gene splicing of the Hybrids and the forced assimilation of Infestation.

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Agreed, as I said before.

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She even says that she is not sure if the protoss as they are now would have been harmed

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She said the xel'naga left them because they were done with them.

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Maybe, but if so, lame. I hope neither Adun nor Tassadar come back, especially not Adun!

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Agreed, for me I hope definitely Tassadar won't come back.

It'll be imba, the overmind will be like wtf this ain't fair man.

Hmm, does anybody want to do a sum-up on the status of the Protoss tribes? Which ones weren't represented in the heirarchy, etc?

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This is a classic example of the trope Sealed Evil in a Can, the only reason he wasn't destroyed outright is because blizzard may intend to use him later. i hope so, Ulrezaj was a cool and unique bad guy.

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Aye. Perhaps for an upcoming Enslavers campaign, Ulrezaj has to be extracted from the crystal in order for the memories need to be accessed, but ends up running free.

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Originally Posted by Kimera757

Maybe, but if so, lame. I hope neither Adun nor Tassadar come back, especially not Adun!

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That's not what I'm saying. His "spirit" does not include his memories. It's essentially a new individual. Adun & Tassadar were very similar, but they were their own individuals. It's possible that they shared the same "spirit".

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No, their actual personalities are there. (It's a pure crystal, not one of the modified ones usually used by the alysaar.) If you tried to access memories, you'd probably end up talking to them, and since Ulrezaj is more powerful, you'd end up talking to him.

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So then, yes, Zamara is engaged in an eternal mental struggle inside a crystal? :[

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1) They're organic tools, designed to create that wormhole.
2) Doubtful, since they seemed to sacrifice themselves to create the wormhole. Only one absorbed protoss and zerg DNA; looks like a plotline which Blizzard dropped.
3) Absolutely not! They didn't need host bodies, as they sacrificed themselves.

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1) I thought they were made out of energy.
3) So they sat in stasis for thousands of years just so they could sacrifice themselves to make a wormhole for Zeratul? I thought there was going to be something more than that. Does that part of the book explicity say they sacrificed themselves? Maybe they disappeared & went to do something else.

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Come to think of it, what part of the xel'naga (other than purity of essence and form) transfer between incarnations? It's like they lose out on a lot of technology and knowledge this way. Do they have some sort of update center? The artifacts maybe?

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What's weird is that the Zerg already absorbed the Xel'Naga's previous incarnations into their gene pool.

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Originally Posted by Gradius

Hmm, does anybody want to do a sum-up on the status of the Protoss tribes? Which ones weren't represented in the heirarchy, etc?

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You should know you can check the wikia :)

The 8 protoss tribes from StarCraft I were (in color/player order) Ara, Sargas, Akilae, Furinax, Auriga, Venatir, Shelak and Velari.

Venatir is briefly mentioned in the manual (in the Sargas section) and has otherwise been unmentioned. Velari was referred to as a province in Frontline volume 3 (which still isn't in stores in Canada yet).

Of the remaining tribes, Sargas wasn't mentioned in the Hierarchy. Presumably it joined with the Nerazim (which are represented as one tribe in the Hierarchy).

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That's not what I'm saying. His "spirit" does not include his memories.

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What? There's no proof of this either way.

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So then, yes, Zamara is engaged in an eternal mental struggle inside a crystal? :[

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And can't, say, tell us what else she knows. :(

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1) I thought they were made out of energy.

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While they're called energy creatures, they are at least partially organic. (It's a bit difficult to have DNA if you have no physical form, and they have organic skin too.)

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3) So they sat in stasis for thousands of years just so they could sacrifice themselves to make a wormhole for Zeratul? I thought there was going to be something more than that. Does that part of the book explicity say they sacrificed themselves? Maybe they disappeared & went to do something else.

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It just says they vanished, but it seems like they turned into the wormhole.

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What's weird is that the Zerg already absorbed the Xel'Naga's previous incarnations into their gene pool.

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Damn odd, considering the xel'naga were already pure of form, why wouldn't the zerg want that? Maybe they couldn't assimilate the xel'naga for the same reasons they couldn't assimilate the protoss.

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Originally Posted by Kimera757

This I don't agree with. The xel'naga were happy with the zerg before they got eaten (so says the manual). Zamara didn't say the zerg hadn't been fully evolved either,

She said the xel'naga left them because they were done with them.

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I direct you to the last paragraph of page 215 and the top paragraph of 216 good sir :)
if you dont have the book it says

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"What i have told you is the way things have always unfolded before," said Zamara "had it been permitted to continue uninterrupted, I am not even sure the protoss as we are now would have been harmed. But this time, something went very wrong. The xel'naga were eliminated before they had completed their preperations, by their own creations -- the zerg. their plans-- eons in the unfolding were thrown into turmoil.

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You may indeed be correct about the zerg, but what other preperations could there be.