Re: PVZ Help : Muta harass
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Carsickness
Now i'm not a bad player, and I can play against most strategies. But when it comes to mass Mutalisk I loose EVERY time. It's getting quite annoying actually
I'm a Protoss player and I just feel like Toss isn't equiped to deal with a Muta attack.
Stalkers fall to easy. Pheonix are garbage because there's no way you can build enough to deal with the threat. And mass Sentry just falls too fast to the accompanying Zerglings.
I think the thing that gets me the most is the fact that I can't move my army. The moment I leave my base for an attack I get Mutas in my worker line, forcing me to return to base.
Anyways. Anyone got a good Muta counter strategy I could maybe try?
Thanx
P.S. I miss Corsairs :(
well, as a zerg player what drives me NUTS against protoss are : Blink stalkers. Quick ambush and mobility is very useful for base defense, also just a few cannons should be able to stop most mutas. Key is to employ a strat where your opponent wont go mutas. Hallucinate a few phoenix very early and fly around, discouraging air..also works to psych out your opponent. Also send obs around to know when forces move about. mutas are not good for base defense as zerg, if they have alot of mutas, attack zerg head on once you scare off the mutas. They will be forced to defend. Early mutas usually = zero defense against a 4 gate push.
That being said, as Zerg i sometimes make mutas just to force my opponent to build anti muta defense with no goal of making more.
Re: PVZ Help : Muta harass
Scout the zerg with your probe and see if he is getting any gas. Zerg dont usually block their entrance so it's pretty easy to send a zealot down if he got a lair yet. If you dont see any roach warren and is upgrading to a lair, it must mean that he is going for mutalisks. Stalkers with blink ability is good at catching mutalisks but having a couple of cannons can help and you can use the forge to upgrade the weapon attack. That's what i think.
Re: PVZ Help : Muta harass
Yeah man it's rough. =/
Your options are to just macro like a beast and split up your army or resort to using "cute" tactics like Stalker blink & Phoenix micro. Cannons are key though because they give you time to react. Be sure to stay on top of your upgrades too - especially for armor, it helps so much.
What I like to do when I move out is move with everything i have, but make sure my Warp Gates are ready to warp in. This makes it look like you're doing an all-in. If he doesn't fall for the bluff by retreating to his base, warp some units in to defend.
Quote:
And mass Sentry just falls too fast to the accompanying Zerglings.
Mass Sentry shouldn't fall to Zerglings if you use force field. I've got a replay of me vs. Muta/Ling if you want to check it out later. Also, pure Stalker/Sentry is surprisingly good against pretty much most Zerg compositions.
Re: PVZ Help : Muta harass
Alright the simple fact is that mutalisks are not a counter to a large ground army. They are extremely expensive and loosing perhaps just 2 of the initial 6 mutalisks that pop out is really bad for the Zerg player. You also have to note that stalkers have twice the range that a mutalisk does so they will never want to directly engage your ground force. You also have a greater sight range with stalkers than the mutalisk so you can see them before they can see you which you can use to your advantage when defending your base.
What you cannot allow zerg to do is contain you with mutalisks and give zerg free reign over the map. So what you need to remember is that by Zerg going mutalisks he has to warrant having those expensive units. He must either get probe kills or map control and if you simply deny him that with a superior ground force he will not be in a good position for the later stages of the game.
I would probably watch through your replays where you loose to it and watch how the build evolves so you can get a sense for the timing the mutalisks pop out. Also take note what he does with his mutalisks does he gain map control and expand? etc.
Re: PVZ Help : Muta harass
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Carsickness
Now i'm not a bad player, and I can play against most strategies. But when it comes to mass Mutalisk I loose EVERY time. It's getting quite annoying actually
I'm a Protoss player and I just feel like Toss isn't equiped to deal with a Muta attack.
Stalkers fall to easy. Pheonix are garbage because there's no way you can build enough to deal with the threat. And mass Sentry just falls too fast to the accompanying Zerglings.
I think the thing that gets me the most is the fact that I can't move my army. The moment I leave my base for an attack I get Mutas in my worker line, forcing me to return to base.
Anyways. Anyone got a good Muta counter strategy I could maybe try?
Thanx
P.S. I miss Corsairs :(
I'm no toss player...but what about High Templars using psi storm. Doesn't it affect mutas? Caveat here is you'd have to get the storms off really, really quick. And you'd have to have a couple cannons and a couple anit-air units to support them.
Re: PVZ Help : Muta harass
The times I've tested the mutalisk moves to fast for psi-storm to be effective.
Re: PVZ Help : Muta harass
I only use mutas to force the P not to go too robo heavy. Otherwise, I'm terrified of phoenii. You should get used to microing them efficiently since that'll likely save you lots of trouble.
When I say "learn to micro them", I mean that you need to be able to do that while doing everything else you'd normally do, like building an army, teching, expanding, scouting, etc...
Re: PVZ Help : Muta harass
Muta harass is never a probably with me on 90% of the maps since I always 2gate forge fast expand against zerg as often as I can. If someone tries to go mass speedling to break my wall off, there is a very very good chance they will go muta because of how weak speedlings are against zealots, and there is not enough minerals to support speedlings and roaches and hydra. The way i personally deal with mutas is with high templar and storm, with a few sentries thrown in as well for guardian shield and their own attack. With chargelots to decimate any of their ground forces.
There are many ways to deal with mutas. first being cannons at your mineral line help a ton since that is where they will go most of the time. Phoenixes destroy them and blinking stalkers can push them back. I have found, that if you are going a largely ground force against someone with mutas, that sentries are so helpful because guardian shield negates nearly all of the muta's bounce damage of its last 2 attacks. I like my mix of chargelots, sentries and templar because of the synergy the provide with fighting mutas. If the mutas come in, throw up a guardian shield. If they attack a sentry I can storm them so they have to run away, and if they dont run away I storm again and they die. Storm does 80 damage in 4 seconds. If I run out of energy on my templars, I make them into archons, which do very well against all zerg units especially since by the time I push I have already researched ground weapons level 2. My method is not for everyone, and is definitely more macro intensive than some, but it works well for me.
Re: PVZ Help : Muta harass
For me Pheonix with cannon can stop with muta harass with ease. You just need to scout more often or you can include stargate in your build order. I always get pheonix early in PvZ to harrass overlords and workerline. It will deter zerg players from getting muta. Even if he does get muta, you will have enough phoenix to deal with.
