Trends i've noticed that could use changes

Infestors are not being used at all. Seriously needs spell changes.

Queen creep tumor should probably be changed. Currently, zerg has two units that just create more creep. The queen and the overlord. Could someone also confirm if sunkens also create creep as well?

No one uses the High Templar phase shift. Not saying it's bad. But should consider making it more interesting considering it's in direct competition with psi storm.

According to beta forums, people feel that roaches are OP. Even if they aren't OP, they've become units that almost all zerg players end up having to tech to for early to mid-game survival. It's a tank that deals good damage and only costs 1 food.

Raven spells could probably use some nerfing. Two attack spells and a defense spell? It's like having a high templar that can fly and cast psi storm while defending itself from most projectiles. And unlike irradiate from SC1, it's difficult to micro units away to minimize the damage they take, seeing as how it's hard to know which unit is targeted, and comes down pretty quickly.

Reapers auto-cast D8 Charges on buildings? =\

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Originally Posted by moosh

Queen creep tumor should probably be changed. Currently, zerg has two units that just create more creep. The queen and the overlord. Could someone also confirm if sunkens also create creep as well?

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Overlords only make temporary creep, and sunkens do not make creep.

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Reapers auto-cast D8 Charges on buildings? =\

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It's like the ultralisk head attack. It's a different graphic that does different damage. It's quite powerful; I think Blizzard looked at the orc raider and went "I like!"

Nydus Worms also create creep where you build them, FYI.

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Originally Posted by moosh

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No one uses the High Templar phase shift. Not saying it's bad. But should consider making it more interesting considering it's in direct competition with psi storm.



Reapers auto-cast D8 Charges on buildings? =\

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Is Phase Shift still in the game?

Last time I looked at templar archives, there was only 2 icons (or did I miss one?) - one for Psi Storm and the other looked like Khaydarin Amulet for energy; can someone confirm this plz?


In response to D8, the answer is Yes and the ability is f*ucking retarded OP as 4-5 reapers can kill a nex/cc/hatch in like 14-16 seconds, and there is absolutely no way to tell even with scouting the Terran base that theyre coming. Def needs nerfing - maybe cutting that 45 damage in 1/2?

High templar get Phase Shift automatically.

I feel like in general the caster abilities are fairly underwhelming.

Protoss casters have two very cool abilities - Force Field and Psi Storm. The mothership has solid abilities but players rarely get a chance to make one. Phase Shift and that anti-range aura are not that interesting (or useful) and don't provide much competition for the alternate skill. High Templars are once again just psi-stormers or half an archon.

Ghosts pretty much call down nukes...I'm not sure if they have EMP or lockdown at all anymore, but I haven't seen anybody use abilities with the ghost other than nuclear strike. I'm also disappointed that although ghosts were supposedly going to be cheaper and more common in SC2, they are actually now far more expensive and at least as rare as they were in SC1.

Ravens are kind of cool, but I think the turrets are more than a little gimmicky, and I don't know if they totally nerfed hunter-seeker or something, but nobody seems to use that skill. I preferred the science vessel's abilities because they were more...sciency.

Infestors don't seem very well thought out to me at all. I don't think the developers have really decided how they want them to be used yet (which is evident from the fact that they've changed so much since they were introducted). Queens are useful, but since they just sit in the base they can't really be a functioning part of your army.

Right now the casters are fairly disappointing. I compare them to the casters from WC3 (I thought they were done well in WC3) and find them wanting.

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Phase Shift and that anti-range aura are not that interesting (or useful) and don't provide much competition for the alternate skill.

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I can't say anything about Phase Shift, but you've obviously never used Guardian Aura. That is a powerful, and highly annoying, ability.

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Ghosts pretty much call down nukes...I'm not sure if they have EMP or lockdown at all anymore, but I haven't seen anybody use abilities with the ghost other than nuclear strike.

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You've clearly not played the game as Protoss. EMP basically screws up their entire ground army.

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Originally Posted by moosh

Infestors are not being used at all. Seriously needs spell changes.

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Agreed for the most part. Or some tweaks to it's existing spells at the very least.

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Queen creep tumor should probably be changed. Currently, zerg has two units that just create more creep. The queen and the overlord. Could someone also confirm if sunkens also create creep as well?

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Uh... they work completely differently. Queen spawn a permanent creep tumour that spreads creep, but must also be cast on creep. Overlord generates creep anywhere, but it must remain stationary while doing so or the creep will dissipate.

And spine crawlers most certainly do NOT spread creep.

Creep tumor is fine.

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No one uses the High Templar phase shift. Not saying it's bad. But should consider making it more interesting considering it's in direct competition with psi storm.

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Nobody knows it's there. Nobody's even BOTHERED to try it as far as I've seen. It's the perfect alternative to Psi Storm anyway. Works on big units, is instantaneous and can't be dodged, etc. etc.

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According to beta forums, people feel that roaches are OP. Even if they aren't OP, they've become units that almost all zerg players end up having to tech to for early to mid-game survival. It's a tank that deals good damage and only costs 1 food.

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Uh, sure. Though they're not all that great against terran. Marauders mess them up pretty badly. So do stalkers, but less-so. A roach rush is pretty hard to counter as Zerg as well.

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Raven spells could probably use some nerfing. Two attack spells and a defense spell? It's like having a high templar that can fly and cast psi storm while defending itself from most projectiles. And unlike irradiate from SC1, it's difficult to micro units away to minimize the damage they take, seeing as how it's hard to know which unit is targeted, and comes down pretty quickly.

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I dunno if they could use nerfing, but I still really don't like Hunter-Seeker Missile. I think auto-turret and defensive drone are fine, though. Defensive drone is limited to certain units and won't protect the Raven from mass units. It's mostly useful against static defenses.

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I'm also disappointed that although ghosts were supposedly going to be cheaper and more common in SC2, they are actually now far more expensive and at least as rare as they were in SC1.

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They were never going to be cheaper. They were dirt cheap in StarCraft 1. What they were going to do was make them lower tech and give them more widely useful abilities. Cloak is A LOT more useful at lower tier, and they make up for their higher cost with much better damage and a higher health score. They 2-shot drones/probes and 3-shot SCVs... that's really good.

I haven't seen them much, but I think that's another case of nobody really knowing what to do with them or when to get them. I think that's why a lot of the casters look lame right now, a lack of knowledge and familiarity.

I've been playing mainly zerg and I must agree with the infestor bit. I've tried them out a few times and while the snare / dot is neat it isn't worth building the unit. I'm disappointed that they can't cast from underground as well.

Everyone keeps saying roaches are OP but they are basing it off what they do to marines or zealots... which they are the counter for. Have you seen marauders, immortals, stalkers or any unit that attacks ground from the air eat through them?

Casters in general I haven't seen a lot of use from, Raven's mainly just being used as an observer. There really isn't much need for phase shift since everything is being massed. It is considerably better to damage the entire opponents army than to remove one unit from attacking / defending (in 98% of situations).

Creep Tumor is neat... but until you upgrade to a Lair the queen isn't regenerating energy fast enough to use one and use spawn larva on cooldown. That tumor isn't worth the extra larva.

D8 charges... holy god are they powerful. You expect that kind of power on an Ultralisk but not an early game unit. I've seen a small group of reapers jump into my base and rape a couple of sunkens before they did much damage at all. You simply pray you have enough 'lings to run 'em off.

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Originally Posted by Nicol Bolas

I can't say anything about Phase Shift, but you've obviously never used Guardian Aura. That is a powerful, and highly annoying, ability.



You've clearly not played the game as Protoss. EMP basically screws up their entire ground army.

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I'm just going on what I've seen in replays. If you say that EMP is used frequently to great effect, I'll take your word for it.

Same for Guardian Aura, although I still think it's an uninteresting ability. It's kind of like Maelstrom only it requires less skill to use.