Purifier Origins

I noticed no real discussion about the Purifiers. I haven't seen any media concerning them, aside from that one short story centering around the Colossi. Where are they from, why were they created, and why were they exiled or sealed away? Why wait until just now to release they from Cybros? Were they even really sealed? Are they the result of some Von Neumann probe that went rogue and created its own artificial nation? Why do they have an equivalent to the Adept?

Any leaks, info or speculation?





And Demo Squid, Economist? Don't even think about it.

[insert reminders of complex macroeconomic predictions that turned out to be true years in advanced.]

[insert bickering about Republicans being evil because of meaningless, simple-minded, petty accusations like being anti-vaccinations and Jesus while arguing bankrupting the economy is the way to go.]

[blah blah blah mean bad shark eating all the leech's food wahwahhwaahahhhwahahh wait til the end of all things and you'll see how superfuckingawesome I'm is]

Okay, now onto the topic:

The Purifiers came out of no where and many things will be retconed for their sake. For once, I might be okay with that, but who cares. The best information I saw was in the panel that showed them. I don't know if its answers your questions but there's not really much known about them, given, you know, they came from no where.

I get how the Tal'Darim and Cy-Bros are supposed to bolster the numbers of the Protoss, reflecting the power boost that Kerrigan garnered from Zerus (both personally and for the Swarm). The Tal'Darim's origins were heavily hinted at by the mere existence of the caverns explored by Zeratul, and were introduced by the Dark Templar saga. I even like the idea of rogue Protoss AI, something I've been wanting since before the release of WoL. Even so... they seem a little out of left field, don't they?

Probably because they are. But, if they're going to retcon, let me be something like this. This expands the universe and justifies the changes, pigeon-holing a love story does not.

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Originally Posted by Visions of Khas

And Demo Squid, Economist? Don't even think about it.

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Its OK, Eco just confirmed I already accomplished my mission.

At this point, I'm assuming it's the same justification and reasoning for why the Primal Zerg came about when they did. Best not to think too much about it, I reckon.

^--agreed

That being said, I've wanted the protoss to create robotic drones to do their dirty work for a long time now.

They need to bring back the Reaver as a subrace of Robots with their own history and social structure. Mostly kidding, but, at this point, anything of substance is better than what we have.

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Originally Posted by Gradius

^--agreed

That being said, I've wanted the protoss to create robotic drones to do their dirty work for a long time now.

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They've been doing just that since back in the SC1 days like with Reavers. It's likely the purifiers were an early experiment, but went haywire and wouldn't obey the Protoss commands, so they discarded them out in deep space, not realizing they as a race could survive.

I dunno...the AI route seems like a cliche way to go. Granted, the gameplay implications look fun, but sentient machines is kind of a turn-off for me. Protoss culture, extremely underdeveloped for this point in the franchise, is bound to be way more complex than robots with brains.

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I dunno...the AI route seems like a cliche way to go.

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It's been established since StarCraft I that the Protoss war effort is heavily reliant upon autonomous war machines. I think it's a natural progression of that theme. It will be interesting to see what made the AI go "rogue" and how the Purifiers are brought into the fold.

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Originally Posted by Visions of Khas

It's been established since StarCraft I that the Protoss war effort is heavily reliant upon autonomous war machines. I think it's a natural progression of that theme. It will be interesting to see what made the AI go "rogue" and how the Purifiers are brought into the fold.

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It feels like a story that's been told a dozen times before. "AI going rogue" has been a trope since the seventies, or probably earlier. Not interested.

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Originally Posted by Nissa

I dunno...the AI route seems like a cliche way to go. Granted, the gameplay implications look fun, but sentient machines is kind of a turn-off for me. Protoss culture, extremely underdeveloped for this point in the franchise, is bound to be way more complex than robots with brains.

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The problem, Nissa, is I believe this will be nothing more than how the primal Zerg concept went in HotS and all that.

Think "Death from Above" mission. You needed to use Dehaka and the primal Zerg to wreck the power link to get the psi destroyer offline.

Therefore, in LotV it's likely the exact same thing will happen. Perhaps Amon will have a weapon that can instantly kill any organic targets, so you have to use the purifiers. Since they're 100% machine, Amon's weapon won't work on them.

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Originally Posted by ragnarok

The problem, Nissa, is I believe this will be nothing more than how the primal Zerg concept went in HotS and all that.

Think "Death from Above" mission. You needed to use Dehaka and the primal Zerg to wreck the power link to get the psi destroyer offline.

Therefore, in LotV it's likely the exact same thing will happen. Perhaps Amon will have a weapon that can instantly kill any organic targets, so you have to use the purifiers. Since they're 100% machine, Amon's weapon won't work on them.

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....I have no idea what you're talking about. My complaint on the subject is that we know next to nothing about the castes of Protoss, nor much besides Dark Templar besides backstory. We don't know who they are as people, and how that has affected the units they create and the way they live now. Any development on the matter is bound to be more interesting than robots.

Unless you're saying that the purifiers are going to amount to the way the primal zerg turned out in HotS -- a huge retcon.

It would be interesting to have the "purifiers" (needs a better name imo) be a rogue AI that is benevolent and non-violent. That's something we don't see regularly and that can make them alien in their own way. We could have reason for them leaving the Protoss because they were too violent (they did use them as war machines). The reason we didn't hear the Protoss didn't talk about them before is because they're ashamed to admit that they're creations were/are more enlightened and less petty than them. There be potential for extra Protoss angst to boot as well.

I know this wouldn't make do for an action-game storyline and all, but I'd find that angle a bit different than the typical "AI is a Crapshoot" trope.

Oh hell, who am I kidding? Hands up who thinks they'll just be nothing more than a plot device to get from plot point A to plot point B/C/whatever?

I'd like it better if they weren't rogue at all. Maybe just some smart machines that work with the 'Toss. That way they complexify Protoss culture without being a trope.

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Originally Posted by Nissa

I'd like it better if they weren't rogue at all. Maybe just some smart machines that work with the 'Toss. That way they complexify Protoss culture without being a trope.

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Technically they WERE smart machines, but the Conclave treated them with contempt and everything. If the Conclave acted differently, things would be different with the purifiers. Maybe they would have even been with the Protoss people during the Aiur invasion

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Originally Posted by Nissa

I'd like it better if they weren't rogue at all. Maybe just some smart machines that work with the 'Toss. That way they complexify Protoss culture without being a trope.

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The definition of "rogue" is subjective. They need to have their origins somewhat tied to Protoss because then people will start complaining they came out of nowhere and such.

I'd honestly prefer them coming out of nowhere to having an out of nowhere affect on Protoss culture. If Rag's description is correct, I find that horribly insulting to the 'Toss.

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Originally Posted by Nissa

I'd honestly prefer them coming out of nowhere to having an out of nowhere affect on Protoss culture. If Rag's description is correct, I find that horribly insulting to the 'Toss.

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It's not MY description, Nissa. This was taken from Blizzplanet and what THEY wrote about the purifier's lore.

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Originally Posted by ragnarok

It's not MY description, Nissa. This was taken from Blizzplanet and what THEY wrote about the purifier's lore.

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"yours" as in you said it.

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Originally Posted by Nissa

I'd honestly prefer them coming out of nowhere to having an out of nowhere affect on Protoss culture.

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These two things can easily go hand in hand though. If the Purifiers have their origins linked to the Protoss, the writing can potentially mitigate the "out of nowhere" effect a bit easier. Sure, it didn't work with the Primal Zergs but still...

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Originally Posted by Turalyon

These two things can easily go hand in hand though. If the Purifiers have their origins linked to the Protoss, the writing can potentially mitigate the "out of nowhere" effect a bit easier. Sure, it didn't work with the Primal Zergs but still...

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It didn't work with the primal Zerg because the SC1 manual made it clear Zerus was left a burning rock.

Now, it COULD evolve into a jungle world, but that would take hundreds of trillions of years or something. A few million years isn't enough for that.

Well, Rag, since you brought up the manual, let me quote it some.

"Through Xel’Naga protogenetic manipulations, the Zerg survived the torrential firestorms of their world and thrived."

Okay, so it wasn't left a burning rock, but clearly Zerus is one. More or less like Char, which is probably why the Zerg settled on a place similar to that.

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Originally Posted by Nissa

Well, Rag, since you brought up the manual, let me quote it some.

"Through Xel’Naga protogenetic manipulations, the Zerg survived the torrential firestorms of their world and thrived."

Okay, so it wasn't left a burning rock, but clearly Zerus is one. More or less like Char, which is probably why the Zerg settled on a place similar to that.

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Which is why a few million years for Zerus to evolve into a jungle world doesn't make any sense. It CAN happen, but you'd need at least hundreds of trillions of years.

Earth has gone through several mass extinction periods, millions is feasible so long as at least a sliver of complex life survives.

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Originally Posted by Jconant

Earth has gone through several mass extinction periods, millions is feasible so long as at least a sliver of complex life survives.

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Except according to the SC1 manual, the Overmind assimilated ALL life on Zerus.

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Originally Posted by ragnarok

It didn't work with the primal Zerg because the SC1 manual made it clear Zerus was left a burning rock.

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No, that wasn't my point. It didn't "work" because the Primal Zerg came off as nothing more than an obvious and intentional plot device that came out of nowhere (except from someone's butt maybe) rather than what should've been a natural extension of that universe.

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Originally Posted by Turalyon

No, that wasn't my point. It didn't "work" because the Primal Zerg came off as nothing more than an obvious and intentional plot device that came out of nowhere (except from someone's butt maybe) rather than what should've been a natural extension of that universe.

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If there really IS a way to completely undo Amon's corruption, then the primal Zerg wouldn't be necessary.

You recall Zeratul's plan to revive the Xel'Naga? It's likely the real reason he told Kerrigan about Zerus and all was merely to get the primal Zerg off the planet so that they could then be used to form the Xel'Naga that way.

Ummmmm... I have no idea what tangent you're going off on, Rag.

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Originally Posted by ragnarok

Except according to the SC1 manual, the Overmind assimilated ALL life on Zerus.

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Not true. I read the manual as I got that quote, and the overmind assimilated some life and destroyed what he didn't see as useful to the swarm. There is no reason, however, why the Overmind would have destroyed plant life in this manner.

Rag has something of a point, Tura. What makes the primal Zerg such a plot device -- besides the retconning of Zerg lore, "necessity" in making Kerri "extra Zerg", and travelling to a planet the Zerg couldn't have reached in a reasonable amount of time -- is that they changed what Zerus really was. They didn't bother referencing in any way Zerus' original nature.

Why do you suppose are vegetal life?
My personal opinion is that the forests are not like vegetal, is animal like polyps (like coral ), some primal zerg could evolve to fill the niche of the plants in the form of polyps, and that is because the existence "plants" that attacked us during the campaign. each "plant" Zerus is a Zerg, if you remember in the last mission Zurvan had something like roots where they were bio electricity
simply the primal Zerg, repopulated Zerus of all possible forms

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Originally Posted by Nissa

Not true. I read the manual as I got that quote, and the overmind assimilated some life and destroyed what he didn't see as useful to the swarm. There is no reason, however, why the Overmind would have destroyed plant life in this manner.

Rag has something of a point, Tura. What makes the primal Zerg such a plot device -- besides the retconning of Zerg lore, "necessity" in making Kerri "extra Zerg", and travelling to a planet the Zerg couldn't have reached in a reasonable amount of time -- is that they changed what Zerus really was. They didn't bother referencing in any way Zerus' original nature.

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It really makes me wonder if the primal Zerg EVER could have left Zerus, if they were given more time and everything....

Purifiers
"The Purifiers were built under direct order of the Conclave to be an ultimate fighting force at a time when the scientists were making technological advancements in intelligent robotics and A.I. The program was originally kept in shadow and unified by the belief that consciousness could be turned into data, thereby used to preserve the thought-process and decision-making ability of a formerly living being. Studies proved that the replications were often 99.3 percent accurate to the protoss subject the replication was patterned after. The Conclave moved to use this technology to build a force replicated from the greatest warriors in history.
They did not, however, treat the Purifiers with the same respect afforded to regular Templar. Instead, the Purifiers were little more than slaves in the Conclave's eyes. Eventually, the Purifiers chose to rebel, killing their masters. In return, the Conclave determined that the Purifiers were too dangerous and banned them. They were powered down and launched away in a command vessel, Cybros, to be reactivated only in the direst of circumstances. "
http://blizzard.gamespress.com/es/Si...tab=documentos

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Originally Posted by Nissa

Not true. I read the manual as I got that quote, and the overmind assimilated some life and destroyed what he didn't see as useful to the swarm. There is no reason, however, why the Overmind would have destroyed plant life in this manner.

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The Zerg left the lifeless, burning world of Zerus and laid waste to every planet they found along their path towards the Protoss Homeworld.

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Originally Posted by Nissa

Rag has something of a point, Tura. What makes the primal Zerg such a plot device -- besides the retconning of Zerg lore, "necessity" in making Kerri "extra Zerg", and travelling to a planet the Zerg couldn't have reached in a reasonable amount of time -- is that they changed what Zerus really was. They didn't bother referencing in any way Zerus' original nature.

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Eh, the effect of "what Zerus was like before" is kinda over-exaggerated if you're asking me. Even if we change that one thing (that Zerus remained as some inhospitable world), the Primal Zerg still feel like they're there only as a plot device to power-up Kerrigan for the final conflict. The Primal Zerg don't work because they're akin to the artifact in WoL or any other previous plot device found in SC (ie: the Xel'Naga Temple and Psi disruptor in BW).

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Originally Posted by Turalyon

Eh, the effect of "what Zerus was like before" is kinda over-exaggerated if you're asking me. Even if we change that one thing (that Zerus remained as some inhospitable world), the Primal Zerg still feel like they're there only as a plot device to power-up Kerrigan for the final conflict. The Primal Zerg don't work because they're akin to the artifact in WoL or any other previous plot device found in SC (ie: the Xel'Naga Temple and Psi disruptor in BW).

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The only reason for the existence of the primal Zerg is for the sake to get the Xel'Naga back. Kerrigan was merely needed to get the primal Zerg off Zerus and that's it.

It's not like she herself can substitute for all that. Despite the primal transformation, she's still just a primal Zerg/terran hybrid, she's not a PURE Zerg.

*reads Drako's post*

*sighs*

*Gives up on LotV*

I wish cybros was the name of the race and not the platform. Purifier is the name of the laser beam and the ship that launches the laser beam. Plus it's boring and generic.

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Originally Posted by Nissa

*reads Drako's post*

*sighs*

*Gives up on LotV*

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I actually like it! Its stupid for a race as advanced as the Protoss to not use robots when lives are at a premium.

There is nothing original anymore. Every trope has already been used. Sorry to break it to u. :P

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Originally Posted by ragnarok

The only reason for the existence of the primal Zerg is for the sake to get the Xel'Naga back.

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This is yet to be verified nor even remotely implied in HotS. Regardless, whatever the specific in-universe reason is for why they're included in the story, it is irrelevent and ultimately meaningless because their actual role in the functional movement of the plot supersedes all. For the purposes of HotS's narrative, the Primal Zerg are a barely disguised and contrived plot device.

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Originally Posted by Turalyon

This is yet to be verified nor even remotely implied in HotS. Regardless, whatever the specific in-universe reason is for why they're included in the story, it is irrelevent and ultimately meaningless because their actual role in the functional movement of the plot supersedes all. For the purposes of HotS's narrative, the Primal Zerg are a barely disguised and contrived plot device.

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It wasn't in HotS. Zeratul only said this in Whispers of Oblivion.