Re: In my opinion, the right choices were made.
Actually, I believe some Blizzard person did say that Reavers and Shuttles were not at all designed to do what they did. I think they said they even considered increasing the firing cooldown or causing it to automatically reset when a unit unloaded, so you couldn't do that. They kept it in because it make it more interesting.
I don't think we should ignore the possibility that developers thought of something before players did, but we shouldn't assume that they did, either.
Did you know that Capcom did not design Street Fighter 2 to have combos? Players figured that out on their own, and the game evolved from there.
Re: In my opinion, the right choices were made.
I like the changes... by one exception: Medivac.
Re: In my opinion, the right choices were made.
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Originally Posted by
spychi
I like the changes... by one exception: Medivac.
I agree with this... I just cant see how can it have much more use then Medic... Medics made Terrans and Marines interesting, Medivac isnt doing that, and also it is higher in the Tech so now Marines dont have anything to counter mass Zerglings+Banelings early game...And it heals 2x Better then Medic but only 1 unit and that isnt enough in big fights, ofc Psy Storm is balanced and Dark Swarm is removed but still i think we wont see much use of him....
Re: In my opinion, the right choices were made.
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Originally Posted by
ManjiSanji
Actually, I believe some Blizzard person did say that Reavers and Shuttles were not at all designed to do what they did. I think they said they even considered increasing the firing cooldown or causing it to automatically reset when a unit unloaded, so you couldn't do that. They kept it in because it make it more interesting.
The funny thing here? They actually made that change. That's how the game works now. Shuttle/Reaver harass is still useful - just not ridiculous the way it used to be.
Re: In my opinion, the right choices were made.
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Originally Posted by
SpiderBrigade
The funny thing here? They actually made that change. That's how the game works now. Shuttle/Reaver harass is still useful - just not ridiculous the way it used to be.
Ah ok
It's been a while since I played, but I can see why they would. I think the comment was something along the lines of, "We did not design the Shuttle to shoot Scarabs."
I thought it was funny =P
Re: In my opinion, the right choices were made.
I prefer renewed and enhanced old units...
Re: In my opinion, the right choices were made.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
RamiZ
I agree with this... I just cant see how can it have much more use then Medic... Medics made Terrans and Marines interesting, Medivac isnt doing that, and also it is higher in the Tech so now Marines dont have anything to counter mass Zerglings+Banelings early game...And it heals 2x Better then Medic but only 1 unit and that isnt enough in big fights, ofc Psy Storm is balanced and Dark Swarm is removed but still i think we wont see much use of him....
The MedEvac is one of the BEST new units in the game. It has more use because it heals the units it carries as well as giving them LoS and quick maneuvering. Its more interesting because its more mobile, but also more vulnerable than the Medic. Its higher tech is on purpose to give Terrans a reason to tech to Starport since they rarely go beyond Factory in SC:BW, and if you hadn't noticed the Marauder has 150 HP and a slowing attack that is meant specifically to help it tank against Zerglings and Banelings for Marines. The MedEvac heals 2x faster than a Medic, so its equivalent to 2 Medics worth of heal and promotes healing micro, all while doing it from the air so it can't get trapped in a cluster of other infantry it's trying to heal and fail at its job, and that ranged healing also lets it stay out of the way of any Storms or GTA units your infantry are fighting.
The unit is brilliant in its simplicity and HAS to be used regardless of its healing ability if you ever want to transport units across the maps anyway. Your ignorance at the superb design of the of the MedEvac offends me.
Re: In my opinion, the right choices were made.
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Let's consider the role of workers in sc... These are design flaws right? Not something that adds depth or strategy to the game but something that detracts from it?
Does it? It seems to me that if something acts well outside of the parameters of your design, then you should look at it and decide whether the action was beneficial or not. And you should also look to see if you can design something that works better for that purpose.
Since workers can still do those things, I'd say Blizzard judged them beneficial. Which is the point: anything that went that far outside the bounds of the design should be looked at. Sometimes you keep it, sometimes you scrub it, and sometimes you improve it.
The last part is critical. Worker harassment was clearly not really something that Blizzard envisioned, certainly not to the degree it has grown. Look at SC2; there are now entire abilities and units specifically designed for that purpose. Instead of Shuttle/Reaver, you have Stalkers+Blink. Plus, Blink is useful for a lot more than just base raiding.
They took an unfinished concept and vastly improved on it.
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It's only fallacious under your understanding that revolutionary unit concepts equates to good gameplay.
Since that is neither my nor anyone else's "understanding" on this thread, I'm not sure who you're talking to.
As for the fallacy of the false dichotomy, let's look at your statement:
"I think cool units and mechanics are nice but making a sub par game simply because you want to keep a cool idea is not. "
This statement presupposes that "cool units and mechanics" necessarily requires a sub-par game. That is, it assumes you cannot have both "cool units and mechanics" and good gameplay. That, for example, giving the Guardian a special ability necessarily causes damage to the gameplay.
It is a logical fallacy to assume that A and B are the only two possibilities, unless you can provide evidence to support that claim. Not only that, it is a demonstrably wrong statement to say that you can't have "cool units and mechanics" as well as good gameplay. Games do it all the time.
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In any case, what you've been saying this entire time, from my perspective, is that strategic depth is not fun, and should be removed for the sake of making a more fun game.
That's because your perspective is warped and twisted by your irrational hatred of "scrubs" and anyone who doesn't bow before the presumed needs of professional gamers.
Re: In my opinion, the right choices were made.
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Originally Posted by
DemolitionSquid
The MedEvac is one of the BEST new units in the game. It has more use because it heals the units it carries as well as giving them LoS and quick maneuvering. Its more interesting because its more mobile, but also more vulnerable than the Medic. Its higher tech is on purpose to give Terrans a reason to tech to Starport since they rarely go beyond Factory in SC:BW, and if you hadn't noticed the Marauder has 150 HP and a slowing attack that is meant specifically to help it tank against Zerglings and Banelings for Marines. The MedEvac heals 2x faster than a Medic, so its equivalent to 2 Medics worth of heal and promotes healing micro, all while doing it from the air so it can't get trapped in a cluster of other infantry it's trying to heal and fail at its job, and that ranged healing also lets it stay out of the way of any Storms or GTA units your infantry are fighting.
The unit is brilliant in its simplicity and HAS to be used regardless of its healing ability if you ever want to transport units across the maps anyway. Your ignorance at the superb design of the of the MedEvac offends me.
I have to agree here. The medivac solves a number of issues: The need for a teching incentive, Terran need for Healing options, making the Dropship equal to the other Transports again. Itīs also a incentive not to retreat the Transport immeadiately after the drop. Itīs not infantry which means that it actually changes the aproach needed to combat MEdivacs+Marines. With Medics you didnīt actually do anything different than pure Marines you just have to try harder/shoot more.
Also on the Terrans being helpless without Medics: Just not true. In the Battlereports we seen neither Healing nor Stimpacks and they still won both matches.
Re: In my opinion, the right choices were made.
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Your ignorance at the superb design of the of the MedEvac offends me.
LOL if that offends you then you are n/c...that would be like if i said that you offended me cuz your least Zerg Favorite unit is Roach...From all those videos, there is one where we can see MedEvac....And also i loved much more Medics then this unit, you could use them as a block, they were interesting for me...He can stay away from Storm, but what is the point when your units will die cuz you will heal only one unit...I mean sure you can micro with it, but you could do that with original Dropship too, Load/Unload....It is my opinion...We dont have same taste, so i dont see how this offends you.
Also Marauder got 125 Hp afaik....They rarely go beyond Factory? Science Vessel is a must in every TvZ MU and they used a lot Dropships too....so No....
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Also on the Terrans being helpless without Medics: Just not true. In the Battlereports we seen neither Healing nor Stimpacks and they still won both matches.
And that is the most stupid argument i have seen :/ sorry no offense but cmon...Terran player was so much better then Zerg player....He got one more expansion then the Zerg, that should tell you something -.- And in TvP BR, Protoss was just massing units that are food for those units that Terran made...wait wait, he saw Marauders that Counters Stalkers and Banshees that Counters Colossi and he did what? Continue making that 2 units -.- Ofc he didnt need healing...
