any thoughts about the UED(spelling)?

in the end of brood war the retreting fleet of the UED(united earth diertory?) was destroyed by the zergs, so this is my question have any of the UED been heard of again ? or mentioned to coming again to the SC2.
as they sent out a MASSIV fleet to take control of the planets where it is you play that system or galexy or what they call it. and they got destroyed and werent heard of again.
wouldent they send out a other fleet or some recon ships to check out what happend to them as I belive it said they was destroyed before they could send messages to the UED.

The fleet sent to Koprulu is only a minute fraction of the UED's total military strength.

And since the journey requires cryo-stasis, I do not think it's easily and quickly made.

Well the total terran population is presumed to be between 150 - 450 milions ( people disagree abot that), but the UED allience (93% of all the human population) total population is presumed to be "over" 200 billions (miliards- EU), now do the math ;)

And the "massive fleet" that you mention was only composed of 3 division ( UED Genetic Engineers , UED Pyrotechnic Engineers , UED Security Guards ), since it primary role was exploration, to explore the "romoured" thread of aliens in that sector, and then make action based on the info. Most of the forces were enginiers and scientist , that were sent to research the aliens.

Early on a colony was sacrificed to the zerg so that the UED could observe live zerg in action. The invaders met with early successes with the routing of the Terran Dominion and augmented themselves heavily by conscripting local forces. The majority of al the UED forces were conscripted locals, and only 3 division were ued elite troops. Since the local population was clasified as expandable.
Even with the conscription of multiple aditional division of troops, the ued tropps - fleet still was outnumbered 4 to 1 by the Terran Dominion forcess.
And even being heavily outnumbered, the ued elite tropps managed to defeat the terrans, defeat the zerg and beslave the overmind and scare of the protoss, not to shaby for such a small force, if you consider that only the Dominion forcess outnumbered them 4 to 1.

They were eventually defeat and fleet the sector, but none of the ships were able to get home, and no signal or report ever reached Earth. The ued videos that you see in the BW campaign were meant for the local conscripted populoation.
Even so isolated pockets of the remnants of the UED Expeditionary Force remain in the Koprulu Sector, hiding in places such as on Abaddon

Now imagine if the UED would attack will all it's forces, can you imagine a fleet 1000 times larger in size and numbers packed with elite profesional trained soldiers instead of the conscript army("militia") they had previously, and with the full support and technologies of the atlas system :D

No military would send all, or even half of their total forces on some longterm distant conquest, simply because it would leave their home (earth) vulnerable.

Personally I'd prefer that the UED just consider the Koprulu sector "not worth it", so we can focus on the stories of the colonies.

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Originally Posted by ragsash

in the end of brood war the retreting fleet of the UED(united earth diertory?) was destroyed by the zergs, so this is my question have any of the UED been heard of again ? or mentioned to coming again to the SC2.
as they sent out a MASSIV fleet to take control of the planets where it is you play that system or galexy or what they call it. and they got destroyed and werent heard of again.
wouldent they send out a other fleet or some recon ships to check out what happend to them as I belive it said they was destroyed before they could send messages to the UED.

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They have no interest in returning as far as we know, but there are some splinter groups left. Vice Admiral Stukov is still alive - who knows what he's up to.

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Originally Posted by Perfecttear

Well the total terran population is presumed to be between 150 - 450 milions ( people disagree abot that), but the UED allience (93% of all the human population) total population is presumed to be "over" 200 billions (miliards- EU), now do the math ;)

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200 billion is kind of high....I calculated 40 billion myself.

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Originally Posted by Perfecttear

And the "massive fleet" that you mention was only composed of 3 division ( UED Genetic Engineers , UED Pyrotechnic Engineers , UED Security Guards ), since it primary role was exploration, to explore the "romoured" thread of aliens in that sector, and then make action based on the info. Most of the forces were enginiers and scientist , that were sent to research the aliens.

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Eh? Those 3 "divisons" were simply special soldiers assigned to oversee the control of the Overmind - I don't think that has anything to do with their actual fleet makeup. Their fleet was comprised of two separate units for ground & air combat, Atlas Wing & Cronus Wing.

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Early on a colony was sacrificed to the zerg so that the UED could observe live zerg in action.

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That was a Dominion colony though.

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Even with the conscription of multiple aditional division of troops, the ued tropps - fleet still was outnumbered 4 to 1 by the Terran Dominion forcess.
And even being heavily outnumbered, the ued elite tropps managed to defeat the terrans, defeat the zerg and beslave the overmind and scare of the protoss, not to shaby for such a small force, if you consider that only the Dominion forcess outnumbered them 4 to 1.

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Where did you hear that the UED was outnumbered 4 to 1?

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The ued videos that you see in the BW campaign were meant for the local conscripted populoation.

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Where did you hear this? O_o

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Now imagine if the UED would attack will all it's forces, can you imagine a fleet 1000 times larger in size and numbers packed with elite profesional trained soldiers instead of the conscript army("militia") they had previously, and with the full support and technologies of the atlas system :D

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To be fair, the Earth colonies might not be that militaristic. We don't know what the situation is back on Earth either; remember, there are still dissident countries.

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Originally Posted by Gradius

They have no interest in returning as far as we know, but there are some splinter groups left. Vice Admiral Stukov is still alive - who knows what he's up to.

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What are you talking about Vice admiral stukovs BODY BLEW up like the terran marines when they die

how could he live after that?

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Originally Posted by ragsash

What are you talking about Vice admiral stukovs BODY BLEW up like the terran marines when they die

how could he live after that?

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You haven't heard of Resserection IV have you?

Also, Game mechanics show the explosion, in reality he was just shot.

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Originally Posted by Shadow Archon

You haven't heard of Resserection IV have you?

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No I havent, dont have a clue what that is.

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Originally Posted by Shadow Archon

Also, Game mechanics show the explosion, in reality he was just shot.

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and havent you seen the new Rambo? :D http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kXOLjOI0cT0

just look at that and you cane compare that with the guns in SC :D that is in quite far in the furture :D (yes im aware of its quite exadurated *spelling*)

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Originally Posted by ragsash

No I havent, dont have a clue what that is.



and havent you seen the new Rambo? :D http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kXOLjOI0cT0

just look at that and you cane compare that with the guns in SC :D that is in quite far in the furture :D (yes im aware of its quite exadurated *spelling*)

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Look it up.

And besides, there would still be blood and guts left over. The zerg could have used that to bring Stukov back to life, albeit infested.

Um, he was shot, and then he talked a bit before he died.

If the gun that shot him was really powerful enough to make him explode, he would be dead instantly.

So no, he didn't explode.

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Originally Posted by Pandonetho

Um, he was shot, and then he talked a bit before he died.

If the gun that shot him was really powerful enough to make him explode, he would be dead instantly.

So no, he didn't explode.

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What I meant was "Even if he had exploded... [insert sentence here]."

But yeah, he did die pretty slowly.

My bad, my post was directed at Ragsash.

Before Blizzard started recapping events of the BroodWars, I had assumed that the UED has fielded a massive fleet to the purpose of pacifying the Koprulu Sector. Why wouldn't they accrue enough forces for such a task? Why send their greatest commanders? You may state that sending off the greater part of a country's military forces would be counterproductive, and that the label of "Expeditionary force" denotes small. The American Expeditionary Force during World War I in the european theatre was composed of one million troops....


Then Blizzard screwed with my logic. Damnit, Chris Metzen.

On Stukov being shot...

It was clearly (from the sound) done with a small-caliber pistol. Stukov probably slowly bled to death, which explains how he could talk. (Duran would have been smarter to have shot him repeatedly in the head.)

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Originally Posted by Perfecttear

And the "massive fleet" that you mention was only composed of 3 division ( UED Genetic Engineers , UED Pyrotechnic Engineers , UED Security Guards )

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As mentioned by myself at StarCraft II Armory, this is wrong. Those are small special units, probably company-sized or smaller. (You also forgot Stukov's Elite Guard.)

There were two big "wings" - Atlas and Cronus.

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Originally Posted by Gradius

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200 billion is kind of high....I calculated 40 billion myself.

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I didn't calculate, there was an article quite a while back, that i read, that also included posts by a blizzard lore writter that stated that the earth populatin increase tenfold -"i think that's how it's spelled" after the events of creating UPL ( by expanding heavily into the space and creating new colonies, since there was no more room on Earth), and the start of the terran colonies.... So by fact we know that the Earth population was stated to be 23 bilions in the 23 centuary, so multiply that by 10 ;)

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Eh? Those 3 "divisons" were simply special soldiers assigned to oversee the control of the Overmind - I don't think that has anything to do with their actual fleet makeup. Their fleet was comprised of two separate units for ground & air combat, Atlas Wing & Cronus Wing.

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I understand that, i only wanted to say that the majority of al the ued forcess were conscripted, and not the original ued army.

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That was a Dominion colony though.

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Did i say it wasn't?

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Where did you hear that the UED was outnumbered 4 to 1?

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I will try to find the actual arcticle, but even so you can find that the ued was "greatly" outnumbered by the Dominion forcess, by just reading the wiki.

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Where did you hear this? O_o

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Comon sense:p
Why would they make videos for the Earth, if we know that it takes years for an message to reach Earth, and that the Earth never recieved any information from the fleet, and what hapened to it. So looking by that, you can easily conclude that the messages were meant for the terran population, that they were heavily conscripting.

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To be fair, the Earth colonies might not be that militaristic. We don't know what the situation is back on Earth either; remember, there are still dissident countries.

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But by just looking at it's history you can see it is heavily militaristic, and yes i know that some south american countries and some colonies didn't join the UPL , even more the reason why it would be militaristic.

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Originally Posted by Perfecttear

I didn't calculate, there was an article quite a while back, that i read, that also included posts by a blizzard lore writter that stated that the earth populatin increase tenfold -"i think that's how it's spelled" after the events of creating UPL ( by expanding heavily into the space and creating new colonies, since there was no more room on Earth), and the start of the terran colonies.... So by fact we know that the Earth population was stated to be 23 bilions in the 23 centuary, so multiply that by 10 ;)

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That just sounds like conjecture though. I don't recall any source saying it increased by 10. Also, 200 billion is still possible, and ~40 bil is near the low end.

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but even so you can find that the ued was "greatly" outnumbered by the Dominion forcess, by just reading the wiki.

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But where?

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Comon sense:p
Why would they make videos for the Earth

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To report on their progress. The UED was only founded because they're all paranoid about aliens invading. The point of the video was to say "don't worry about aliens invading." Also, the video wouldn't have said that the Overmind was "believed to be planning the invasion of the Earth itself" or included Stukov if it wasn't addressed to the inhabitants of Earth. Why would conscripts care about any of those things? And why would they even need a video when they're right there? O_o

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if we know that it takes years for an message to reach Earth

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We don't know that though. The UED is probably using faster-than-light transmissions.

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and that the Earth never recieved any information from the fleet, and what hapened to it. So looking by that, you can easily conclude that the messages were meant for the terran population, that they were heavily conscripting.

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We don't know that they didn't receive information from the fleet, just that "No UED vessel ever made it back to Earth to report what had transpired." The only information they "didn't receive" was the status of the UED fleet after their defeat by Kerrigan. We don't know if they did or did not send an actual signal though. Take Dugalle's letter for instance - why would he write it if he didn't think his wife would receive it?

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Originally Posted by Perfecttear

But by just looking at it's history you can see it is heavily militaristic, and yes i know that some south american countries and some colonies didn't join the UPL , even more the reason why it would be militaristic.

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Right, but if they're militaristic it means they've been fighting wars against each other, which means their military has suffered heavy losses. I'm not saying they wouldn't be powerful, but I doubt they simply send a fleet "1000 times the previous size."

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Originally Posted by Gradius

That just sounds like conjecture though. I don't recall any source saying it increased by 10. Also, 200 billion is still possible, and ~40 bil is near the low end.

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Okay the exact numbes are not that really important, but still any way you look at it, the UED HEAVILY outnumbers the terran forcess. And if you use the same population growth for both groups, that people use for the terran, the 200 actually becomes a very low number.

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But where?

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Seriousllly? I thought it was public knowledge, that the Dominion outnumbered the UED forcess? There are probaly multiple sourcess stating this, as for the wiki, just read the "UED Expeditionary Fleet" site part;)

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To report on their progress. The UED was only founded because they're all paranoid about aliens invading. The point of the video was to say "don't worry about aliens invading." Also, the video wouldn't have said that the Overmind was "believed to be planning the invasion of the Earth itself" or included Stukov if it wasn't addressed to the inhabitants of Earth. Why would conscripts care about any of those things? And why would they even need a video when they're right there? O_o

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That completely depends on how you look at it. And it doesnt help, that different lore sourcess are saying differrent things, and some lore from blizzard itself, doesn't make sense:confused: i'm even having problems understaning it myself, some of the ued lore doesn't make sense with the Broodwars campaign and vice versa.

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We don't know that though. The UED is probably using faster-than-light transmissions.

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The key point being "probaly".

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We don't know that they didn't receive information from the fleet, just that "No UED vessel ever made it back to Earth to report what had transpired." The only information they "didn't receive" was the status of the UED fleet after their defeat by Kerrigan. We don't know if they did or did not send an actual signal though. Take Dugalle's letter for instance - why would he write it if he didn't think his wife would receive it?

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The same as i alredy said, and you did to, we don't know for sure, since some lore doesn't make sense, so let's just leave it at it.:p

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Right, but if they're militaristic it means they've been fighting wars against each other, which means their military has suffered heavy losses. I'm not saying they wouldn't be powerful, but I doubt they simply send a fleet "1000 times the previous size."

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Probaly not:p , but that was not my point to begin with, i just wanted to say that the ued was not defeated, and they still have a very large army. ( Since you actually find people that think that the whole earth army was defeated:p)

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Originally Posted by Perfecttear

( Since you actually find people that think that the whole earth army was defeated:p)

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That is definitely very strange, Perfecttear.

I think they might be confused with how Kerrigan hunted down the rest of the fleet and destroyed it (DuGalle committing suicide of course).

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Originally Posted by PerfectTear

since it primary role was exploration, to explore the "romoured" thread of aliens in that sector, and then make action based on the info.

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"Rumoured"? This is what I take issue with. The BroodWar Chronicles led us to believe the UED already had a lot of information regarding Protoss and Zerg force consistency and movements. To send in a small volume of "elites" and select military technologies, to the task of "pacifying" alien resistance and subsuming militant colonies into the whole of the UED, strikes me as very silly.

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Originally Posted by Perfecttear

Seriousllly? I thought it was public knowledge, that the Dominion outnumbered the UED forcess? There are probaly multiple sourcess stating this, as for the wiki, just read the "UED Expeditionary Fleet" site part;)

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Well, that part sources the Emperor's Fall mission. But there is nothing in that mission which says that they were outnumbered, only that the Dominion's standing forces are substantial. I don't think the Dominion would be considered "under siege" as it says in the mission if they outnumbered their attackers. I'd say it's a mistake on the wiki writer's part.

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That completely depends on how you look at it. And it doesnt help, that different lore sourcess are saying differrent things, and some lore from blizzard itself, doesn't make sense:confused: i'm even having problems understaning it myself, some of the ued lore doesn't make sense with the Broodwars campaign and vice versa.

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Well, what lore are you looking at? :p

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The key point being "probaly".

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I think it's safe to say most factions have FTL transmission capabilities, as I'm sure lots of stuff wouldn't make sense. Tassadar himself managed to contact the Protoss on Aiur from Char using only the power of his & Zeratul's mind. :P

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Originally Posted by Gradius

Tassadar himself managed to contact the Protoss on Aiur from Char using only the power of his & Zeratul's mind. :P

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"With our powers combined...!"



I think it safe to say the UED has FTL communications. They were able to get info about the K sector and prepare accordingly in a very short amount of time. The ending cinematic of the BW is meant only to show that no individual ship was able to make it home, not that news of their defeat didn't reach earth.

Could some one help me understand this sentenced quoted from the wiki :

"Four years later the Dominion became the strongest terran force in the Koprulu Sector, vying with the Kel-Morian Combine and the Umojan Protectorate for influence.[16] Kerrigan launched a major attack against the Dominion, resulting in "billions" of terran casualties."

How can that make sense?

It doesn't. <_<

I suspect they'll retcon the original populations of and/or the time of arrival of the supercarriers in the k-sector.

The early sneak preview of WoL - the one with non-Clotworthy-Raynor - had a correspondent corroborate that statement, saying the surprise Zerg assault resulted in casualties "in the billions".

That took me by surprise, and apparently others as well. I remember Kimera or someone saying shortly there after "millions", not "billions", were lost.

Maybe something strange happened in the K sector, like their own brand of the Clone Wars? *shrug*

It makes perfect sense to me. Today, millions live in New York City alone. The earth's population is somewhere around 6.5 billion. All you would need to do in SC to annihilate billions is take out, like, two planets — maybe just one if it's densely populated.

You have to take into the account that only 40 000 Terrans came to the Sector initially, a lot of them died when one of the supercarriers crashed, the Protoss burned down many worlds of the Terrans, and it's only be something like 500 years.

200 years tops.

StarCraft I took place in 2499. The terrans have been in the sector for two centuries. The billions figure works if humanity expanded as fast as possible, made plausible by all those empty worlds out there. (Empty when first found, and Tarsonis, Moria and Umoja were almost empty even after the terrans landed.)

I think the growth figure ha to be 6% per year, which is about the maximum humanity has ever spread on Earth, or maybe a bit more. (By the time modern medicine was invented, the world was almost covered in settlements anyway. The terrans probably had advanced medicine from the beginning; you didn't need ATLAS for that. Just basic knowledge of disease, plus empty space, would make it possible to exceed maximum human growth figures on Earth.)

I wonder if it might be possible that additional refugees from the UED may have fled to the K sector to escape... whatever. Assuming the UED is more dictatorial than Mengsk's regime. Would provide some reason for the population growth, and make for interesting backstory to boot.

They probably are pretty dictatorial. After all, they banned all Religion and made English the main language of Earth (both of which I fully support of course.. hehe)

But they did do some good stuff too, like get rid of racial separatism and advance technology. What's interesting though is probably that the UED is very advanced technologically and rely little on stuff such as psionics, while the inhabitants of the Koprulu sector have very advanced psionics and ghosts.

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Originally Posted by Visions of Khas

I wonder if it might be possible that additional refugees from the UED may have fled to the K sector to escape... whatever

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Both Duke and the protoss seemed really surprised at Earthlings being that far away from home. I think there's been no contact.

And I would like to know how the UED/UPL knew what was going on from that far way. I keep thinking ATLAS was secretly sending them info via FTL communication system, and when Tarsonis (and it) got destroyed, there was panic on Earth.

Well, I had a theory concerning the ATLAS and the Umojans feeding them information, but considering their neutral stance it seems unlikely. They DID have the only functional carrier, however.

And that wrecked supercarrier is still sitting on Umoja. (It was described in a Map of the Week/Month).

The three non-wrecked supercarriers... we don't know what happened to them, except for the one on Tarsonis, which was cut up and made into police stations. ATLAS and Umoja... odd theory.

Wait, I thought all the carriers save for the one on Umoja were dismantled or destroyed. Hm, I'm getting rusty.

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Originally Posted by Kimera757

And I would like to know how the UED/UPL knew what was going on from that far way. I keep thinking ATLAS was secretly sending them info via FTL communication system, and when Tarsonis (and it) got destroyed, there was panic on Earth.

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In the CD cover for Brood War it has some lore that is supposed to directly link up with the SC Manual. It mentions that the UPL had constantly kept-up with the activities in the K-Sector. They originally intended to stay out of the way, but once the alien races appeared, they felt the need to intervene. So, they made plans make war on the aliens, and the "momentous occasion" brought most of the remaining dissident countries into the government, turning the United Powers League (UPL) into the United Earth Directorate (UED).

Kerrigan was foolish to kill them all. She should had let the ships return to Earth completely infested.

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Originally Posted by Norfindel

Kerrigan was foolish to kill them all. She should had let the ships return to Earth completely infested.

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And they would get blasted by the other fleets that the UED had. The fleet that was returning to earth was not the full might of the UED.

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Originally Posted by Shadow Archon

And they would get blasted by the other fleets that the UED had. The fleet that was returning to earth was not the full might of the UED.

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Except that they only need one ship crashing on Earth to cause serious damage. The UED can be very advanced, but if there is a biological threat running wild across the planet, a lot of people is going to die like flies. The worse epidemy ever.

Kerrigan shouldn't tick off the UED.

Fighting them off is one thing. Declaring war on them is quite another. Kerrigan doesn't have that kind of power; it's a one-way trip to loserville.

Also, controlling zerg at that distance is probably impossible anyway.

Speaking of Zerg command, do we have any proof of zerg being left behind by a commanding entity? Aside from those zerg rampaging over Aiur, which was less due to Kerrigan's control and more to do with the fact she hadn't yet assumed control over 'em yet.

Or am I displaying more StarCraft lore rustiness? =P