Heart of the Swarm Sept 2012 beta unit details - leaked video

Noctis, something to remember.

Version 1 beta Mothership was incredibly overpowered... like defending bases by themselves overpowered. I remember one game I took out a 70 pt army by my own mothership because of it's 25 energy warp mechanic and enhanced shield regen.

With that in mind, I say that any analysis of the early beta units should be approached with a grain of salt. I'd say we'll have a better view of how HOTS will be by version 3. (The notorious roach food increase from 1 to 2 for example!)

If we're going to see it gutted, it should be by then.

I really did like the motherhood core being attached to the nexus, able to jump back and forth as a cannon. I think it could of stayed as that with some fine tuning adjustment to make it not so imbalanced. Would of liked them to try and balance it as is instead of slowly floating around now. But I've just played the custom map, not the real thing yet.

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Originally Posted by Gifted

Noctis, something to remember.

Version 1 beta Mothership was incredibly overpowered... like defending bases by themselves overpowered. I remember one game I took out a 70 pt army by my own mothership because of it's 25 energy warp mechanic and enhanced shield regen.

With that in mind, I say that any analysis of the early beta units should be approached with a grain of salt. I'd say we'll have a better view of how HOTS will be by version 3. (The notorious roach food increase from 1 to 2 for example!)

If we're going to see it gutted, it should be by then.

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Ah yes I'd forgotten that...back when the momma ship was cool T_T the core is cool, by making it mobile you can have it move with the army as it upgrades to the mothership

http://starcraft2.judgehype.com/news...ons-defis-etc/

Last missions on Zerus, eh? Probably Xel'naga-related? And could that "tentacle monster" be the omegalisk from the concept art?

"Posthumousmitosis"? So Zerglings will split into Broodlings or something upon death? And will we be able to use Kerrigan to directly infest buildings or untis? Man I'm looking forward to this game.

Since we'll be visiting Zerus, I'm thinking Kerrigan will definitely meet the Xel'Naga and even unleash the Dark Voice itself, forcing the Protoss to deal with it in Legacy of the Void.

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Originally Posted by Visions of Khas

"Posthumousmitosis"? So Zerglings will split into Broodlings or something upon death?

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This was one of the abilities in the earliest HotS SP screenshots, it's 20% chance of spawning 2 broodlings after death or something like that.

Has anyone pored through the editor to find campaign assets like in WoL's beta?

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Originally Posted by Kostov

http://starcraft2.judgehype.com/news...ons-defis-etc/

Last missions on Zerus, eh? Probably Xel'naga-related? And could that "tentacle monster" be the omegalisk from the concept art?

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It does raise an interesting possibility. Though look at the planet list, how they're in alphabetical order. I don't think it's necessarily mission order, considering how there's apparently three on Korhal (matching the three on Char from WoL).

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Originally Posted by Muspelli

Has anyone pored through the editor to find campaign assets like in WoL's beta?

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Don't think anyone cares anymore.

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Originally Posted by Visions of Khas

"Posthumousmitosis"? So Zerglings will split into Broodlings or something upon death? And will we be able to use Kerrigan to directly infest buildings or untis? Man I'm looking forward to this game.

Since we'll be visiting Zerus, I'm thinking Kerrigan will definitely meet the Xel'Naga and even unleash the Dark Voice itself, forcing the Protoss to deal with it in Legacy of the Void.

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ehh i dont think the xel'naga will appear till LotV if they do at all, otherwise i can see sc2 ending with a faction of zerg and toss uniting to become the next xel'naga generation and have a new faction for sc3. for zerus i think kerrigan may find some xel'naga knowledge and perhaps a confrontation with the dark voice. remember with kerrigans death the dark voice controls the zerg. raynor saving her was the game changer.

Blizzard has explained how the xel'naga (except possibly the Fallen One) are now dead. The xel'naga won't be back, but I could picture Kerrigan going to Zerus in order to collect some information or old tech.

However, Zerus is really far away. I don't think Kerrigan could go there during the course of the war. Perhaps Zerus will just appear in someone's memory.

When did they say that? Thought there was every indication that there was some xel'naga still around, such as forming the backbone of the trilogy, to Zeratul's outright statement that the xel'naga are returning.

As for Zerus, I think it'll actually be visited, though presumably there'll be some McGuffin to make it possible for a return trip within a decent timeframe.

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Originally Posted by Hawki

When did they say that? Thought there was every indication that there was some xel'naga still around, such as forming the backbone of the trilogy, to Zeratul's outright statement that the xel'naga are returning.

As for Zerus, I think it'll actually be visited, though presumably there'll be some McGuffin to make it possible for a return trip within a decent timeframe.

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the return of the xel'naga would also be fulfilled by the proper planned union of protoss and zerg resulting in the creation of xel'naga.

coming starcraft 3 - release date TBD "soon".

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Originally Posted by Noctis

the return of the xel'naga would also be fulfilled by the proper planned union of protoss and zerg resulting in the creation of xel'naga.

coming starcraft 3 - release date TBD "soon".

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Dunno-I again refer to Zeratul's "save or destroy" line concerning their return, and I doubt such a union is possible now. Certainly not within the timeframe of the series.

And I disagree with SC3-"soon" is too...soon. Try "soonish" instead.:p

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Originally Posted by Hawki

As for Zerus, I think it'll actually be visited, though presumably there'll be some McGuffin to make it possible for a return trip within a decent timeframe.

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Uh, the UED had the FTL to travel from Earth to the Korpulu sector 60,000 light years away under a month. The Zerg gave them a head start at the end of Brood War, and chased them down, suggesting they have superior FTL to the UED.

Zerus is near the Galactic core.

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Originally Posted by Shadow Archon

Uh, the UED had the FTL to travel from Earth to the Korpulu sector 60,000 light years away under a month. The Zerg gave them a head start at the end of Brood War, and chased them down, suggesting they have superior FTL to the UED.

Zerus is near the Galactic core.

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Did the UED ever engage in FTL travel back to Earth though? Judging by the ending cinematic of BW, I'm guessing they didn't.

Zerus is probably closer to the Koprulu sector than Earth, but it still took the zerg an extended period of time to reach the K-sector-it took 60 years alone for them to reach the sector for wherever they were when the Overmind learned of humanity. All things considered, the travel times for the zerg should be slower nowadays as I can't see Kerrigan using the same wormholes the Overmind did. Behemoths and leviathans can get her around, but for a trip to Zerus?

Hence, McGuffin. Or a plothole. We'll find out I guess.

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Originally Posted by Hawki

Did the UED ever engage in FTL travel back to Earth though? Judging by the ending cinematic of BW, I'm guessing they didn't.

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We don't see them overrun in the cinematic though. The description seems to hint at them retreating, only possible at this scale with FTL.

We either have to believe their idiots for not using their own FTL, usable in seconds out of atmosphere, or that the Zerg chased them down.

Occam's razor suggests the simplest solution.

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Zerus is probably closer to the Koprulu sector than Earth, but it still took the zerg an extended period of time to reach the K-sector-it took 60 years alone for them to reach the sector for wherever they were when the Overmind learned of humanity.

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Simply explained that the Zerg took their time. Remember, the trip took thousands of years and they were invading hundreds of worlds along it and integrating new life into their swarm.

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All things considered, the travel times for the zerg should be slower nowadays as I can't see Kerrigan using the same wormholes the Overmind did.

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Why not? I doubt that the Overmind was the only being capable of Zerg FTL considering the other factions capable of it. For example:

Alan Schezer's Brood. They moved to multiple planets in the series of Enslavers.

After the Overmind's death, the Renegade Zerg's arrival on Shakuras and Kerrigan's brood that arrived there as well.

Ulrezaj had his own brood IIRC and it moved at FTL too.

Her abilities may be degraded, but I don't think that's proof of no FTL capability.

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Behemoths and leviathans can get her around, but for a trip to Zerus?

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Not unbelievable. Who says that the wormhole thing is unique to the Hiveminds themselves? They very well could do it by themselves.

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Hence, McGuffin. Or a plothole. We'll find out I guess.

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....I think people around here like to hit the plothole button too much. It's perfectly explainable with what we have.

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Originally Posted by Shadow Archon

We don't see them overrun in the cinematic though. The description seems to hint at them retreating, only possible at this scale with FTL.

We either have to believe their idiots for not using their own FTL, usable in seconds out of atmosphere, or that the Zerg chased them down.

Occam's razor suggests the simplest solution.

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The Hyperion is an oddity, but at the least, I could entertain the notion that Horner had already plotted a course and charged the warp engines, a process that takes hours. Terran vessels are stated to have to emerge from warp space further away than protoss ones, but as the Hyperion was modified by the Umojan Protectorate, I could see Horner pulling it off.

Concerning the UED, their tech is more advanced, but I could assume that the same rules apply to an extent-time to charge engines and time to plot a course. First order of business is to get away from Char Aleph and Kerrigan. Presumably that didn't work out. And besides, if they DID enter warp space, could the zerg really engage them? Nothing against that, but it's quite rare in sci-fi where your x-space can be a potential battleground.

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Originally Posted by Shadow Archon

Simply explained that the Zerg took their time. Remember, the trip took thousands of years and they were invading hundreds of worlds along it and integrating new life into their swarm.

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There's no real indication of how long the trip took-I'd go for centuries or a millenium at the most. Either way, keep in mind the zerg were essentially going from point a to point b, eliminating/assimilating species they found along the way, not zig-zagging across the galaxy. Might be some diversion, but nothing major.

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Originally Posted by Shadow Archon

Why not? I doubt that the Overmind was the only being capable of Zerg FTL considering the other factions capable of it. For example:

Alan Schezer's Brood. They moved to multiple planets in the series of Enslavers.

After the Overmind's death, the Renegade Zerg's arrival on Shakuras and Kerrigan's brood that arrived there as well.

Ulrezaj had his own brood IIRC and it moved at FTL too.

Her abilities may be degraded, but I don't think that's proof of no FTL capability.

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I didn't say the zerg didn't have FTL, I said that I doubted they'd have the Overmind's MO. In theory, a wormhole should provide a faster travel time than other methods of transport (and does in the series via protoss/xel'naga warp gates) Behemoths and leviathans can enter warp space on their own volition, travelling normally. Kerrigan's used them before for that, she uses a leviathan again in HotS. Point is, there's never been any indication that she has the ability to do the even faster method the Overmind used.

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Originally Posted by Hawki

The Hyperion is an oddity, but at the least, I could entertain the notion that Horner had already plotted a course and charged the warp engines, a process that takes hours. Terran vessels are stated to have to emerge from warp space further away than protoss ones, but as the Hyperion was modified by the Umojan Protectorate, I could see Horner pulling it off.

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You have to note that there are two different Warp processes.

Warp jumping, from Queen of Blades, stated to take hours.

Sub-Warp, from Uprising, Liberty's Crusade, and Twilight. A process that can be initiated within seconds.

Presumably there are limits to sub-warp compared to Warp.

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Concerning the UED, their tech is more advanced, but I could assume that the same rules apply to an extent-time to charge engines and time to plot a course. First order of business is to get away from Char Aleph and Kerrigan. Presumably that didn't work out. And besides, if they DID enter warp space, could the zerg really engage them? Nothing against that, but it's quite rare in sci-fi where your x-space can be a potential battleground.

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Well, it is possible. We don't really know, but there is enough "wiggle room" to suggest that they did, or sub-jumped a good distance away and were preparing for a full on Warp.

Though, it also depends upon the order they were defeated in the mission (no canon statement for it) and what limitations the Zerg have, if any.

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There's no real indication of how long the trip took-I'd go for centuries or a millenium at the most.

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They appear in the mid 2400s, we know they were created after the Protoss by an unknown amount of time. Assuming the Xel'naga made a year trip at most considering there supposed origins, there's still the remaining amount of time for the Aeon of Strife to finish, the build-up of the Protoss Empire, and Adun's time period roughly 700 to 1000 years before the main game, it has to be over a thousand years.

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Either way, keep in mind the zerg were essentially going from point a to point b, eliminating/assimilating species they found along the way, not zig-zagging across the galaxy. Might be some diversion, but nothing major.

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Originally Posted by Starcraft Manual

The Zerg left the lifeless, burning world
of Zerus and laid waste to every planet
they found along their path towards the
Protoss Homeworld. As they progressed
slowly through the trackless dark between
the stars, the Zerg assimilated only the
strongest of the races that they came
across. The swarm continued to build
steadily, ever-increasing in size and
power. As they progressed, the Overmind
sent out numerous deep-space probes
that scouted ahead of the swarm,
searching for new worlds to plunder.
Despite innumerable victories, the
Overmind was greatly disturbed. The
Overmind was aware that the Protoss had
become a highly psionic race, able to
bend and warp the very fabric of reality
to their whims. It sought a way to counter
the awesome might of the Protoss, but
found no answers among the genetic
strains it devoured.
On the verge of despair, the Overmind
made an amazing discovery. One of its deepspace
probes had relayed the location and
vital statistics of a race that occupied a series
of nondescript worlds, right under the
shadow of the Protoss.
The new race, called Humanity, was mere
generations away from developing into a
formidable psionic power. But the Overmind
also knew that Humanity was still in its infant
stages, hardly capable of defending itself
against the ravenous Zerg. Although a shortlived
and seemingly frail species, the
Overmind knew that Humanity would be the
final determinant in its victory over the
Protoss. If it could assimilate the psionic
potential of Humanity, the Overmind would
have the ability to combat the Protoss on its
own terms.
Thus, the Zerg swarms slowly made their
way towards the burgeoning worlds of
Humanity. The journey lasted for sixty years,
but eventually the massive, extended Zerg
Swarm reached the outskirts of the Terran
Sector of Koprulu

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Well, there's an explanation for this.

One, the Zerg took their time, making a slow approach and growing their forces.

Two, the Zerg's psionic ability increased with there time experimenting on humans allowing faster than light travel.

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I didn't say the zerg didn't have FTL, I said that I doubted they'd have the Overmind's MO. In theory, a wormhole should provide a faster travel time than other methods of transport (and does in the series via protoss/xel'naga warp gates)

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Sure. But how do we know that it is faster than there other travel methods or that lesser hivemind beings can't create one?

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Behemoths and leviathans can enter warp space on their own volition, travelling normally. Kerrigan's used them before for that, she uses a leviathan again in HotS. Point is, there's never been any indication that she has the ability to do the even faster method the Overmind used.

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There's also been no mention that she can't as well. You would say that I can't prove a negative, and thus burden of proof falls on me. So, let me get some quotes.

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Originally Posted by Starcraft

Zerg Overmind
I am well pleased young Cerebrate, and so long as my prize remains intact, I shall remain pleased. Thus, its life and yours shall be made as one. As it prospers, so shall you. For you are part of the Swarm. If ever your flesh should fail, that flesh shall be made anew. That is my covenant with all Cerebrates.
Now you have grown strong enough to bear the rigors of warp travel with the Swarm. Thus we shall make our exit from this blasted world and secure the Chrysalis within the Hive cluster, upon the planet Char.
Zasz
Remnants of the Protoss fleet still linger within this planet's orbit. They will attempt to block our exodus at every turn.
Daggoth
My Brood shall aid you, Cerebrate, should you require assistance.

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Originally Posted by Queen of Blades

“Now you have grown strong enough to bear the
rigors of warp travel with the Swarm,” the Overmind
stated, its words sending a thrum of power through the
Swarm. “Thus we shall make our exit from this blasted
world and secure the Chrysalis within the Hive Cluster
upon the planet Char.”
As one the first brood rose, soaring high above the
ruined city. They broke free of the planet’s weak, fading
grasp and approached the storm above, pulled into
that yawning, beckoning darkness at its center, and
vanished. The cerebrate felt their transit through the
hive-mind link all zerg shared and allowed a spark of
contentment to linger within its own mind. Then the
Overmind summoned it as well, and the cerebrate
called its brood together, linking them tightly for travel
through the warp. They rose from the crater, letting
the power of the Swarm fill them as they ascended
and soon the darkness had drowned out all thought,
all sense, as it carried them across the vastness of space
to their destination.
And within the Chrysalis, faintly visible through its
thick skin and viscous contents, a body writhed in
pain. Though not conscious the figure within shifted,
stirred, unable to lie still as the zerg virus penetrated
every cell, changing DNA to match their own. Soon
the Chrysalis would open and the new zerg would
emerge. All the Swarm exulted with the Overmind.
And, as they departed and Tarsonis died behind
them, the mind trapped within the Chrysalis screamed.

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That's literally all we have on the process.

It could also be that the Zerg's Warp Space FTL is just as fast or that it is the same.

Regardless, we don't have the info to really debate it.

Also to point out, the Zerg travel using Void psionics, not Khalai based psionics.

May I offer an alternative theory?

Warp travel is probably resource-intensive, particularly over long distances. It could be that the UED forces retreated and regrouped elsewhere in the Korprulu Sector to take on fuel and make repairs, at which point the Zerg ambushed them.

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Originally Posted by Quirel

May I offer an alternative theory?

Warp travel is probably resource-intensive, particularly over long distances. It could be that the UED forces retreated and regrouped elsewhere in the Korprulu Sector to take on fuel and make repairs, at which point the Zerg ambushed them.

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The problem here is that this isn't suggested in the lore and doesn't explain how the Terrans' Super Carriers stayed in Warp Space for 28 years straight without needing a refuel.

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Originally Posted by Manual

Eventually, the warp-drive engines of the
four supercarriers reached critical meltdown.
After twenty-eight years of warp travel, the
huge ships emerged into real space near the
edge of a habitable star system. Some 60,000
light years from the Earth, their engines
destroyed and their life-support batteries
nearly exhausted, the ships engaged their
emergency protocols and plummeted towards
the nearest habitable worlds in the system

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It only stopped when the engines were destroyed.

What we know is that the UED managed a 60,000 light year trip under a month, even possibly under a single week, and this was just due to their normal FTL engines.

No one comments on them being absurdly fast and when they retreat, the Zerg hunted them down and slaughtered them.

I think that's sufficient proof for them to have the FTL to reach Zerus within a year, considering that depending upon exactly where it is in the core and where the Korpulu Sector is, that it could be relatively a short distance compared to the travel to earth.

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The problem here is that this isn't suggested in the lore and doesn't explain how the Terrans' Super Carriers stayed in Warp Space for 28 years straight without needing a refuel.

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Refer to any of the hundreds of 'hard' science fiction books for plausible explanations.

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Originally Posted by TychusFindlay

Refer to any of the hundreds of 'hard' science fiction books for plausible explanations.

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I'm not going to make up an explanation with no basis on the Starcraft universe. :p

It's either we believe they can move around the galaxy relatively fast, or we assume it's a plothole. I think the 60,000 light years under a month for the UED, and them apparently not even remarking at this advantage as special is proof of that the Zerg have the FTL to get to Zerus in a reasonable time frame.

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Originally Posted by Shadow Archon

... the Zerg have the FTL to get to Zerus in a reasonable time frame.

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This depends on what you classify as a reasonable time frame and in what context. Either way, it'll be interesting to see how they can justify a "side trip" to such a distant location that may take a month (or some considerable amount of time) to get to when the threat of the DV is so near and imminent in the K sector.

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Originally Posted by Turalyon

This depends on what you classify as a reasonable time frame and in what context. Either way, it'll be interesting to see how they can justify a "side trip" to such a distant location that may take a month (or some considerable amount of time) to get to when the threat of the DV is so near and imminent in the K sector.

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Look at it like this.

The UED has an FTL that can, go at 1,440,000c or 720,000c.

The Zerg managed to chase them down when they retreated.

Even assuming that it is half the distance from earth, that's only a week or two of travel time assuming UED numbers. Any faster than that, and it's less time.

The DV threat won't be happening too soon. There was a two year gap between WoL and HotS. There might be another one for LotV.

EDIT: But yes. There explanation for it, if any, will be nice.

Keep in mind that the UED we're not using their FTL engines (or warp drive, or several other possible machines of interstellar travel. Mass Relays, anyone?) when the Zerg caught up to them.
Assuming that they did not break light-speed thousands of times over, they probably used a warp drive. A warp drive bends space in a way that makes travel between two points much, much faster, so a trip between K-sector and earth is not entirely unrealistic (besides, Earth has been putting tons of research into interstellar travel. After hundreds of years of dedicated research, a prototype warp drive could have been constructed and mounted in the Aleksander).
To use such a warp drive, it would require enormous amounts of energy. After all of the resources spent in the campaign to take Koprulu, it's very much likely that they simply didn't have enough energy to get back to Earth with the drive. Upon retreat, Kerrigan simply had one of her broods attack the fleet.

That's what I always thought, anyways.

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Originally Posted by topsecret221

Keep in mind that the UED we're not using their FTL engines (or warp drive, or several other possible machines of interstellar travel. Mass Relays, anyone?) when the Zerg caught up to them.

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We never actually see the Zerg catch up to them (I think those are Wraiths, not scourge at the end of the video), and we don't know where they are.

A sub-warp jump would do fine, and they could probably get far away enough to prepare a full warp. The question is how fast is there sub-warp,
is there actual warp similar to the Hyperion's in SC2, and where they were at when the Zerg jumped them.

If the UED could get away but didn't, it means their idiots.

Thus Occam's Razor, the Zerg are faster than the UED.

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Assuming that they did not break light-speed thousands of times over, they probably used a warp drive. A warp drive bends space in a way that makes travel between two points much, much faster, so a trip between K-sector and earth is not entirely unrealistic (besides, Earth has been putting tons of research into interstellar travel. After hundreds of years of dedicated research, a prototype warp drive could have been constructed and mounted in the Aleksander).

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How is "Warp" drive any different than there current Warp engines?

One works by an alternate dimension, one works by space time.

Why would they go in one direction of FTL travel and go into another? One is not the evolutionary path of the other.

Also, this is just kinda of speculation with no substance to base it upon. I'm not trying to be mean, but this is never commented on as something done that was special.

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To use such a warp drive, it would require enormous amounts of energy. After all of the resources spent in the campaign to take Koprulu, it's very much likely that they simply didn't have enough energy to get back to Earth with the drive. Upon retreat, Kerrigan simply had one of her broods attack the fleet.

That's what I always thought, anyways.

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Again, a bit more speculation based off nothing in the lore. Don't want to come off as condescending, but generally, the best speculation is based on quotes and such.

As for a quote:

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Originally Posted by Queen of Blades

Raynor understood at once. Pilots and navigators planned warp-jumps very carefully, often for hours beforehand. That was because a single mistake could send a ship millions of light-years off course, turn it inside out, or worse. Plus the warp engines usually needed a few hours to warm up. Jumping without preparation or planning was sheer madness.

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Millions of light year jumps are possible for Terran ships in the Korpulu sector. So there's not a energy problem for long travel. I have an idea for it:

Possibly, they have a time dilation affect inside of it though. In real space, travel time is rather short, however in Warp Space, more time is exhibited aboard the ship.

Thus the need for Cryo-Chambers for a two week to a months time of travel.

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Originally Posted by Shadow Archon

Millions of light year jumps are possible for Terran ships in the Korpulu sector.

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Um, you do realize the galaxy is only 130,000 light years in diameter, right?

Sorry, I've kind of given up on trying to work out the details of warp space bar maintaining the wiki article, but the stickler in me just had to point that out.:)

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Originally Posted by Hawki

When did they say that? Thought there was every indication that there was some xel'naga still around, such as forming the backbone of the trilogy, to Zeratul's outright statement that the xel'naga are returning.

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In Twilight, they pretty much confirmed their deaths.

The more recent artifacts were, I presume, the Fallen One's creation, but there's no guarantee.

And yes, Zeratul could be conflating the hybrids with the xel'naga, because in a way they are xel'naga (just twisted ones).

As for the UED, I don't know how long it took for the trip to the K-Sector, but I suspect it takes a lot of time and energy to prepare to jump 60,000 light years, and they just didn't have enough time before the zerg fell on them. (It's a bit like trying to charge up the afterburners, but you need an hour to do it, while the zerg will land on you in 45 minutes.)

While a terran ship might be able to jump millions of light years, I don't believe it's ever been stated to happen deliberately. The terran vessels in Uprising, at least, seemed to take a long time to get places. (Same in the comics. Even a relatively short trip took at least two days.)

I try to avoid using anything presented in the Queen of Blades. It is one of the worst SC novels, and the facts that are presented are sketchy at best. The changes to the storyline that are presented in the book that are actually good didn't deserve to be wrapped up with everything else that book changed.

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Originally Posted by Hawki

Um, you do realize the galaxy is only 130,000 light years in diameter, right?

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Yes. He would end up outside the galaxy. :p

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Sorry, I've kind of given up on trying to work out the details of warp space bar maintaining the wiki article, but the stickler in me just had to point that out.:)

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Oh, it's okay.

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Originally Posted by Kimera757

As for the UED, I don't know how long it took for the trip to the K-Sector, but I suspect it takes a lot of time and energy to prepare to jump 60,000 light years,

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I'm going off the timeline. They left after the Overmind died, and appeared in the Korpulu sector possibly before the Protoss campaign dependning upon when the intro happens.

There isn't a lot of time there, and as for energy, we don't know if longer jumps require more power.

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and they just didn't have enough time before the zerg fell on them. (It's a bit like trying to charge up the afterburners, but you need an hour to do it, while the zerg will land on you in 45 minutes.)

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This goes against the sub-warp in uprising and the warp in "Escape from Mar Sara" where they were capable of jumping to different solar systems in seconds.

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While a terran ship might be able to jump millions of light years, I don't believe it's ever been stated to happen deliberately. The terran vessels in Uprising, at least, seemed to take a long time to get places. (Same in the comics. Even a relatively short trip took at least two days.)

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We don't know the distances though, the speed of Korpulu sector Terran ships in comparison to UED ships, and the size of the Korpulu Sector. There's literally no way to judge the distance.

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Originally Posted by topsecret221

I try to avoid using anything presented in the Queen of Blades. It is one of the worst SC novels, and the facts that are presented are sketchy at best. The changes to the storyline that are presented in the book that are actually good didn't deserve to be wrapped up with everything else that book changed.

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It's unfortunately canon, and thus it has a valid interpretation of the events. With no canon policy, all contradictions are equally canon.

IMHO, I don't see what's wrong with the Zerg getting to Zerus within two weeks.

FTL in Starcraft suffers a lot because the original game didn't really define how it worked, so then the other authors writing the books basically had to invent their own stuff, and so there are a lot of contradictory information. FTL is, after all, a pretty important part of any soft science fiction universe.

Having said that, Blizzard has tried to mesh it all together, if in a rather haphazard way.

The way I figure it works, based mostly on the later novels, is a little like this: There are two types of FTL, warp travel, and sub-warp travel.

Warp travel requires extensive calculations to be performed before initiated, and it's also non-linear in nature (that means it doesn't go from point A to point B at a certain speed), judging by the quote about a miscalculation putting a vessel millions of lightyears away from their current location in the blink of an eye. Travel to a specific location does still take time, however. It's disorienting for the people inside the vessel, and it looks as if you're trying to travel through a blue tunnel.

Sub-warp travel on the other hand works more like FTL in nBSG, with a vessel winking out at location A and then winking in at location B, almost as if by teleportation. This requires no calculations. I'm assuming there's some downside to this (like fuel consumption or perhaps range) because otherwise there'd be no point in using regular warp drives. This is also the type of warp travel that Raynor appears to use in WoL.

The reason I believe Blizzard has tried to fix this is because both systems are demonstrated in the Dark Templar trilogy, written by the same author. So it seems they told her of both types of FTL travel.

In regards to Zerus and the Zerg, the revelation that they can travel to Zerus is perhaps exactly that... a revelation, but not that problematic. The UED certainly has the capacity to travel such distances in little time, and it's not impossible for the Zerg to be faster or as fast. Why the long travel time originally? Perhaps they spent most of that time assimilating new species and improving themselves? Or maybe they've simply evolved their FTL to become faster?

I do believe that Zerus is going to be one of those "travel there and back again at the speed of plot" type deals, considering we've seen some artwork with Kerrigan on Zerus.

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Originally Posted by Shadow Archon

...all contradictions are equally canon

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I hope you're not trying to justify ass-pulls. :p

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Originally Posted by Shadow Archon

IMHO, I don't see what's wrong with the Zerg getting to Zerus within two weeks.

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Regardless of the possibility of such a thing, who says the Zerg or Kerrigan have to get to Zerus in the first place? One would think that there'd still be Zerg on their homeplanet of all things.

Also, who's to say that those faraway Zerg can't be controlled via psychic powers over distances of light years? I'm sure the Overmind was doing that easily beforehand. If the Overmind thinks Kerrigan to be more powerful than itself, let alone expect her to take over its reigns, shouldn't we expect Kerrigan to be able to do that as well?

The devs say so, because they mentioned that Kerrigan is on the front lines in EVERY mission, if I'm not mistaken.

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Originally Posted by Turalyon

I hope you're not trying to justify ass-pulls. :p

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I'm not justifying it, I'm just saying that someone who uses any Starcraft lore that contradicts other lore in Starcraft is still valid. For example, the Uprising version of the Korhal bombardment is just as valid as the Manual or Liberty's Crusade, or I'Mengsk despite the minute or big differences.

There is no canon policy, so therefore all are equal.

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Regardless of the possibility of such a thing, who says the Zerg or Kerrigan have to get to Zerus in the first place? One would think that there'd still be Zerg on their homeplanet of all things.

Also, who's to say that those faraway Zerg can't be controlled via psychic powers over distances of light years? I'm sure the Overmind was doing that easily beforehand. If the Overmind thinks Kerrigan to be more powerful than itself, let alone expect her to take over its reigns, shouldn't we expect Kerrigan to be able to do that as well?

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She's going to be on Zerus because she's always going to be on the front line in every mission, and Zerus doesn't have normal Zerg going off the datamines, but I won't say anymore due to spoilers.

The devs say a lot of things...

As to spoilers, I don't mind. I expect utterly ridiculous things to potentially happen in SC lore these days so I can't say I'd be too surprised if it happens to be spoilerish.

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Originally Posted by Turalyon

The devs say a lot of things...

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And their word is law. :p

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As to spoilers, I don't mind. I expect utterly ridiculous things to potentially happen in SC lore these days so I can't say I'd be too surprised if it happens to be spoilerish.

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Spoiler than:

Primal Zerg on Zerus.

The UED use some version of FTL where they gain increased speed by trading off time in their local field of reference. That's why they were able to get there in like 2 weeks, but had to come out of cryo-hybernation. They were frozen and the journey probably lasted years in their frame of reference, so I don't think it makes sense that the zerg would have this capability.

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Originally Posted by Gradius

The UED use some version of FTL where they gain increased speed by trading off time in their local field of reference. That's why they were able to get there in like 2 weeks, but had to come out of cryo-hybernation. They were frozen and the journey probably lasted years in their frame of reference, so I don't think it makes sense that the zerg would have this capability.

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Just like in Aliens, huh?

Where did you hear that?

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Originally Posted by Gradius

The UED use some version of FTL where they gain increased speed by trading off time in their local field of reference. That's why they were able to get there in like 2 weeks, but had to come out of cryo-hybernation. They were frozen and the journey probably lasted years in their frame of reference, so I don't think it makes sense that the zerg would have this capability.

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Going by what?

Anyways, Zerg are immortal, why would time matter?