Heir Apparent Cinematic

No my problem is not that Raynor mistakes a blonde gentleman for Arcturus. Me and freespace were discussing this, and we'd appreciate it if somebody could clue is into what exactly the hell happened?

So Valerian warps in with Arcturus's flagship and doesn't introduce himself like a normal person. He'd be an idiot to think that Raynor wouldn't be alarmed by Mengsk's flagship. Seems like all he wants to do is make a grandiose entrance.

Raynor decides that it would be a good idea to board the flagship despite being outnumbered. Matt says "this is not a smart move" but that does little to alleviate the audience's confusion. No shit it's not a smart move, why is it even happening?

The missing gap of info though is mostly in the time from when Raynor & Tychus are boarding the Buccephalus via their transport.
1) Why do the other Dominion battlecruisers not fire on them? And why wouldn't Raynor have considered that?
2) Why isn't Matt attempting to raise the Buccephalus?
3) Is Valerian just sitting there twiddling his thumbs?

It feels like this should have been an entire installation type mission that we missed.

Then they board the ship, and kill a bunch of Dominion marines because Valerian couldn't introduce himself like a normal person. Valerian & Warfield have absolutely no pride, as they totally ignore all of their men that Raynor killed even prior to this cinematic.

Raynor himself could have gotten killed, but he's an immortal prodigy, so we can't have that. It also raises the question of why Raynor didn't bring more men. Apparently two marines is all the firepower you need to get to the emperor on his own flagship.

I found this cinematic horrible in many ways. This is what I thought after thinking a bit about it.

Plot:

Warfield, "Any more plans for the invasion of Char, Sir?"
Valerian, "Hey we got a crapload of resources, and I could take my dad's ride too!"
Warfield, "Good idea Sir, but shouldn't we get one more Battle Cruiser to invade Char?"
Valerian, "Oh well, we have a problem here. We will lose the invasion if we don't get an additional Battle Cruiser... Hey! I have an amazing idea! Let's go find Raynor and tell him we need him for Char!"
Warfield, "You are a Genius Sir!
Valerian, "He will be so happy when he sees all those Battle Cruisers as allies! Oh god I need to pop out of nowhere so that he can see our present and feel all the joy at once."
Warfield, "Should we call some Marines to receive him with a cake?"
Valerian, "Don't be silly. If they take their guns instead, it will be just like receiving a brother in arms."

Some time after

Matt, "Sir are you taking a single dropship into the Dominion fleet?"
Raynor, "Yes, why?"
Matt, "Oh, nothing Sir I just had a wild thought, but it doesn't matter."
Raynor, "Call Tychus, I'll need him. Even if he backstabs me if Mengsk is indeed there, because I know he works for my old friend. I just ignore that all the time."
Matt, "Should I at least create a diversion, Sir?"
Raynor, "Get some rest Matty, you need some spare time."

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Originally Posted by Gradius

Raynor decides that it would be a good idea to board the flagship despite being outnumbered.

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I think this is the major issue from which all the other stuff stems. Not only is Raynor outnumbered but he is offered no guarantee that they'll not open fire nor are we told that the Dominion ships are disabled, which would at least be an attempt to logically explain the feasibility of the action at all.

I'm not really sure whether the Hyperion actually docks with the Buchephalus or whether Raynor boards transport to the Bucephalus. Either option would seem ludicrous (both action expose themselves/ are vulnerable to easy retaliation) when confronting an active enemy.

All I can reason for Raynor's action is that he must have latent suicidal tendencies. Given that he's supposed (?) to be in a drunken haze and is constantly depressed this is the only real justification. Otherwise, there's no logical reason why Raynor could ever conceive of his boarding action ever being successful. Also, considering that the running theme of WoL is that improbable/impossible events actually turn out in favour of the "good guy" (see Overmind), at least it's being consistent... :rolleyes:

Are you seriously accusing SC:WoL's script to be sub-par? Surely you jest.

Good to see this thread, Gradius. There is no logical way this cinematic makes any sense. Like I said on MSN, there are 5 minutes of footage missing here, and even then, it wouldn't make sense.
This is an insult to StarCraft fans. Fans that have been with the franchise since 1998, reading all the books, playing the games numerous times, debating the storyline and chatting about what is to come.
I still have hope for HotS, but things like this and a few others (the way they handled the Tassadar reveal in SC2), make me die a little inside.

There's just a lot of flaws working together to make WoL's storyline bad.

I guess there isn't any more to say on this topic since no-one has offered up a better 'in-universe' explanation than I have (he must be bat-shit crazy) for why Raynor would decide to take on a whole Battlecruiser by his lonesome (not including Tychus because we know he's got a screw loose already).

Seeing how "suspension of disbelief" seems to be a common justification for all the recent goings-on in the Starcraft universe, I'm starting to think that the moniker "Wings of Liberty" was just a euphemism for the approach Blizzard's writing staff were told to take when forming the story. :p

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♫Good authors too who once knew better words,
Now only use four letter words
Writing prose, Anything Goes.♫

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While the cinematic has its problems, I don't exactly fault Raynor's decision to attack. Unless the Hyperion was prepared for a warp jump (unlikely), their only options would be an emergency warp (highly risky) or trying to outrun battlecruisers that, given the divide in class, would likely be superior in speed among other things. That, and the shields were down. A chance to take out Mengsk, no matter how small, would be one he would take in light of the lack of better choices.

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Originally Posted by Hawki

While the cinematic has its problems, I don't exactly fault Raynor's decision to attack. Unless the Hyperion was prepared for a warp jump (unlikely), their only options would be an emergency warp (highly risky) or trying to outrun battlecruisers that, given the divide in class, would likely be superior in speed among other things. That, and the shields were down. A chance to take out Mengsk, no matter how small, would be one he would take in light of the lack of better choices.

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They infiltrated Korhal on a giant war machine called the Odin. I think Raynor had the resources to kill Mengsk while he slept. Matt revolution was perhaps more important, and that's why they did not killed Mengsk back there.

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Originally Posted by Hawki

While the cinematic has its problems, I don't exactly fault Raynor's decision to attack. That, and the shields were down. A chance to take out Mengsk, no matter how small, would be one he would take in light of the lack of better choices.

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I don't think anyone here doubts that Raynor would leap at the chance to take Mengsk down. The problem is the choice of action he decides to take for this chance.

In the time Raynor and co. got suited up, boarded transports, flew the distance between the Hyperion and the Bucephalus, fight his way through to "Mengsk's" hiding spot and maybe gun him down, Raynor could have just ordered a Yamato blast to the bridge of the Bucephalus what with their shields powered down. Both actions net the same outcome but with less potential personal risk and harm for the latter option.

Really, aside from "plot armour" and "inept enemies" reasons, the only other realistic reason Raynor was able to get so far to eventually face Valerian was because Valerian wanted him to - which is logically ridiculous in itself. I mean Valerian risks the life of his men and his own personal safety (Raynor really could have just shot him) just for a dramatic entrance?

Why the Buchephalus doesn't hail Raynor or provide any sort of resistance would have clued Raynor into something not being right and yet he opts to personally jump into a potential lion's den without wanting further information. One can only conclude that Raynor has a death wish.

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Originally Posted by Hawki

Unless the Hyperion was prepared for a warp jump (unlikely), their only options would be an emergency warp (highly risky) or trying to outrun battlecruisers that, given the divide in class, would likely be superior in speed among other things.

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It's kinda funny that you bring this up as an action that is unlikely and highly risky. Surely it can't be more unlikely and risky than Raynor diving headfirst (and with his own body on the line, mind you) into an uncertain battle and coming up trumps. The fact that this is what incidentally happens does not ease the issue of how insane Raynor's actions are when there are plenty of reasonable alternatives. Given the "leaps of faith/suspend disbelief" moments we are meant to swallow throughout WoL, an emergency warp (or even just plain exchanging ship-to-ship fire) at least is both easier to swallow and makes a helluva lot more sense logically than what we have here.

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Originally Posted by Turalyon

I guess there isn't any more to say on this topic since no-one has offered up a better 'in-universe' explanation than I have (he must be bat-shit crazy) for why Raynor would decide to take on a whole Battlecruiser by his lonesome (not including Tychus because we know he's got a screw loose already).

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Have you tried the Battle.net forums? I'm sure the likes of JohnnyZeWolf and Brathearon will shove at ya a bunch of bullshyt theories and pass them off as justifications as to why Heir Apparent played out the way it did.

Theres a reason the Battle.nets Story Forum is practically dead, and it's not because people are tired of talking about the same plotlines in Starcraft. It's because it's plagued by two fanboys who chase everyone off with their never ending bullshyt, and you can't even call them out for it without Blizzard tagging you with a ban just because we apparently upset the loyal fanboys....which is a total of TWO people plus a forum troll that shows up now and then (theFaT) who Blizzard STILL hasn't perma-banned.

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Raynor Shot First!

The Dominion Marines were just defending the Prince; as Raynor, fueled by his rage against Arcturus, recklessly decided to board the Bucephalus. He didn't shoot Valerian, though; he was ready to, but Junior talked him down.

Since Valerian basically allowed the attack to happen, we can assume he actually *wanted* it to happen in the first place. Because he has a flair for dramatic entrance? Because he wanted to test Raynor's resolve? Because he's in reality a sadistic SOB?

Hopefully, Heart of the Swarm will provide us with an answer.

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Enjoy the bullcr@p. Infact, just look at the Battle.net version of this thread. The whole Chrono vs Johnny duel on the first page really speaks for itself.

http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/3424904967

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If we have to justify every single event on a game on our own, then the writters did a really bad job. I guess some part of us still wants SC2 to be epic, but we can only hope that Blizzard stops hearing the wrong group of people and actually fixes the problem.

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Originally Posted by RetlocLive

Have you tried the Battle.net forums?

I'm sure the likes of JohnnyZeWolf and Brathearon will shove at ya a bunch of bullshyt theories and pass them off as justifications as to why Heir Apparent played out the way it did.

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Luckily (or unluckily if you'd like) then I'm restricted only to the EU forums.

On the one hand, I have to commend their tenacity. It must be very peaceful for them to be able to justify the stuff in WoL so easily to themselves as if there were no problems at all. :p

I must say that the quote you provided is pretty much a watered down explanation of my own (Raynor and Valerian are both crazy - its just that the former is suicidal and the latter is a vainglorious arse). Whether you find it satisfying or logical is another matter entirely. Whatever the case maybe, WoL has essentially set a precedent for pretty much "anything goes" such that I seriously wouldn't be surprised if Raynor was to be revealed as the second coming of Jesus by the end of LotV.

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Originally Posted by The_Blade

If we have to justify every single event on a game on our own, then the writters did a really bad job.

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Nail on the head there, Blade.

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On the one hand, I have to commend their tenacity. It must be very peaceful for them to be able to justify the stuff in WoL so easily to themselves as if there were no problems at all.

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Yup, that sounds about right. Doesn't matter how you tweak your elaboration of the flaw; they just deny, deny, deny. And they have Blizzard backing them up which is probably why they're so determined to chase off criticisers. I think my favorite quote was when I asked Brathearon if there was acually anything he disliked about the Wings of Liberty's story and his answer was...he hated the Zerg gameplay... -_-

As for the Heir Apparent cinematic...I obviously hate it, and I cringe everytime I hear Valerian's overdramatic "A chance to rescue.......SARAH.......KERRIGAN."

So disgusting...

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I'll actually go against the trend and instead say that I feel that the cinematic was actually well choreographed and tightly structured. Sure, it's not 100% realistic but then again, what fiction is? Moreover, it is not egregiously unrealistic. Rather, it runs on the following tropes:

1. Bellisario's Maxim (i.e. if it's not an integral part of the story/event, don't think too much about it)
2. Rule of Drama
3. Establishing Character Moment

There was almost certainly an entire raiding party attacking Valerian's battlecruiser. The reason we didn't see anyone other than Raynor and Findlay is because they are narratively unimportant and wouldn't be missed if absent. Same with the raiding party's insertion into the battlecruiser and the raid in general up to Raynor's confrontation with Valerian. Could there have been a mission in there? Certainly, yes. However, it was neither crucial nor necessary to have been done that way.

Regarding the Hyperion, there are a number of possible explanations. Perhaps the Hyperion's crew is simply that good (coupled with Valerian wanting Raynor's team as an ally as opposed to space dust). Perhaps the Hyperion took evasive maneuvers and stayed out of range of the other battlecruisers rather than engaging them. Once again, it's ultimately unimportant since nothing happened to them and it isn't completely logic defying that it worked out that way.

Lastly, there's Valerian calmly waiting for Raynor. The way the scene was set up was not only dramatic but it quickly established what kind of character Valerian was (i.e. smug, confidant, cunning, manipulative, etc). While it would have been more realistic for Valerian to have had a gun at the ready, with personal bodyguards on hand next to him or cowering before Raynor's gun, all of this would have painted a very different picture of Valerian.

As such, the cinematic was actually quite effective; getting its point across clearly while staying nice and brief (as a game cinematic should be).

Heir apparent got the point across pretty clear; 'To Establish an alliance between Raynor and Valerian.' It's the execution to achieve it that sucks.

You honestly believe it makes sense that Valerian's OVERALL objective in this cut-scene is to establish an alliance with the Raiders yet his men are seen firing upon Raynor and Tychus? What if one of those fodders acually killed Raynor?



Valerian: Alright men, were here. Now lets talk to Raynor to establish this alliance.

Fodder Soldier A: Ya...about that...we kinda killed him.

Valerian: WHAT?!?! WHY?

Fodder Soldier A: He came guns ablazing onto our ship! We were defending ourselves!

Valerian: WHY WOULD YOU FIRE UPON SOMEONE I WAS TRYING TO TEAM UP WITH!?!?

Fodder Soldier A: Uh...he shot first?

Valerian: DIDN'T YOU TRY TALKING TO HIM?!?! TELL HIM THAT WE WANTED TO BE FRIENDS?!?!

Fodder Soldier A: I was just trying to stay alive...


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From the behind the scenes material in relation to the video, I got the impression that Raynor's reckless behavior was intentional and not so much an oversight. It's meant to show he's starting to crack and that he's looking for vengeance so hard it's starting to cloud his better judgement.

What Valerian was thinking is another matter and harder to explain. Why didn't he simply call up the Hyperion to tell them everything rather then have Raynor board his battlecruiser? I guess it was some form of "let's see if he's really as good as they say he is" type of test, though I'm certain there are better ways to find that out.

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Originally Posted by RetlocLive

Have you tried the Battle.net forums? I'm sure the likes of JohnnyZeWolf and Brathearon will shove at ya a bunch of bullshyt theories and pass them off as justifications as to why Heir Apparent played out the way it did.

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I'm pretty sure I lost several IQ points from my time debating with those two.

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Originally Posted by mr. peasant

There was almost certainly an entire raiding party attacking Valerian's battlecruiser. The reason we didn't see anyone other than Raynor and Findlay is because they are narratively unimportant and wouldn't be missed if absent. Same with the raiding party's insertion into the battlecruiser and the raid in general up to Raynor's confrontation with Valerian. Could there have been a mission in there? Certainly, yes. However, it was neither crucial nor necessary to have been done that way.

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This interpretation makes the whole scenario way worse though, the fact that Raynor and Valerian both lost valuable men off screen. And all just because Valerian couldn't warp in and introduce himself like a normal person. This is a travesty by any stretch of the imagination.

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As such, the cinematic was actually quite effective; getting its point across clearly while staying nice and brief (as a game cinematic should be).

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I doubt anyone here has issues with the cinematography, as it was handled by the art team, who actually did their homework. Considering that WoL is supposed to be a character-driven story, however, the cinematic failed because as Turalyon said, it depicts Raynor as mentally deranged and Valerian as negligent/incompetent.

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Originally Posted by Gradius

I'm pretty sure I lost several IQ points from my time debating with those two.

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Chrono deserves a god damn medal. The fact he can continuously put up with Johnny and Brathearon without driving himself nuts is just unbelievable.

These are the common types of timber flooring, each of them has advantages and drawbacks so as someone who plans for timber installation for homes or any buildings, it is a must to study which among them will be best suited for you so that you will not regret in the end and so the Timber Flooring is that you expected will come out and there will be no wastes of materials, money, time and efforts.

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Originally Posted by mr. peasant

Sure, it's not 100% realistic but then again, what fiction is? Moreover, it is not egregiously unrealistic.

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I guess it does depend on interpretation and context but the problem still stands that you really have to stretch your interpretation of the context to accommodate it and make it seem logical.

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Originally Posted by mr. peasant

1. Bellisario's Maxim (i.e. if it's not an integral part of the story/event, don't think too much about it)
2. Rule of Drama
3. Establishing Character Moment

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Using these are well and good but must they be so blatantly obvious? I know that every story is filled with tropes but at least the better ones do something in an attempt to hide them. Sometimes the best stories told are those that don't sound like you're being being told a story if you catch my meaning.

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Originally Posted by mr. peasant

There was almost certainly an entire raiding party attacking Valerian's battlecruiser. The reason we didn't see anyone other than Raynor and Findlay is because they are narratively unimportant and wouldn't be missed if absent. Same with the raiding party's insertion into the battlecruiser and the raid in general up to Raynor's confrontation with Valerian. Could there have been a mission in there? Certainly, yes. However, it was neither crucial nor necessary to have been done that way.

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This reasoning makes sense and is justified but a consequence of this is that it does risk making Raynor seem like he's an untouchable god that always gets what he wants given the apparent ease with which he's even able to reach Valerian. Something like this is often at odds with a universe that is primarily known as being crapsack.

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Originally Posted by mr. peasant

Regarding the Hyperion, there are a number of possible explanations. Perhaps the Hyperion's crew is simply that good (coupled with Valerian wanting Raynor's team as an ally as opposed to space dust). Perhaps the Hyperion took evasive maneuvers and stayed out of range of the other battlecruisers rather than engaging them. Once again, it's ultimately unimportant since nothing happened to them and it isn't completely logic defying that it worked out that way.

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And yet we spend 3/4 of the game doing "ultimately unimportant" (narratively speaking) missions. Surely it can't be that hard to at least hint at how Raynor was able to achieve what seemed like an extremely difficult task. If he was just moseying up to meet a friend then it's understandable to not show how he docks to that ship. But to not even hint at how a suicidal action against an outnumbered and outgunned with a sworn enemy that has vowed to bring him to 'justice' was made possible is mystifying.

It's like the issue with Raynor's mindset at the start of the game - we can imagine (or be told even) 4 years explaining his change in demeanor but that does not make it anymore satisfying. Even moreso when the proposed narrative angle of the story is supposed to be more about "character" than plot-driven. When the writing/ execution of it is so wishy-washy like these examples, it's going to be hard to determine what is and what is not "ultimately important".

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Originally Posted by mr. peasant

Lastly, there's Valerian calmly waiting for Raynor. The way the scene was set up was not only dramatic but it quickly established what kind of character Valerian was (i.e. smug, confidant, cunning, manipulative, etc). While it would have been more realistic for Valerian to have had a gun at the ready, with personal bodyguards on hand next to him or cowering before Raynor's gun, all of this would have painted a very different picture of Valerian.

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It's supposed to show this, but the depiction of it reeks more of an obvious and manufactured manipulation of the story by the writer to try and get you to think this. The ludicrous nature of the scenario, lack of information and the fortuitous circumstances that play out all just feed into this.

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Originally Posted by l33telboi

From the behind the scenes material in relation to the video, I got the impression that Raynor's reckless behavior was intentional and not so much an oversight.

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It's a pity you actually need the behind-the-scenes material to even get an impression of what could have been going on...

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Originally Posted by l33telboi

It's meant to show he's starting to crack and that he's looking for vengeance so hard it's starting to cloud his better judgement.

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Starting to crack? Raynor risking his very life on a boarding action that is heavily stacked against him is tantamount to suicide/ a death wish rather than "clouded judgement".

Hilarious post by a guy named Stretch on the b.net forums:

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Let's say you have a coworker who was a complete ##@!@@!* to you in the past. You two had a falling out over a love triangle or something, and now it's everything your supervisor can do to keep you away from each others throat. Let's say it's been some length of time, and you want to make up and put this all to rest. You can either...


1.) Call him up and say, "Hey, we've had a rough past, but let's grab lunch and see if we can make amends."


Or...


2.) Knock on his door in the middle of the night with five of your friends at your back. They all have bats, chains, brass knuckles, etc that you told them to bring. You also told them to look menacing. When your coworker open the door, he sees six heavily armed men staring him down, so he (being a total badass, a la Raynor) reasonably proceeds to defend himself, and kicks the !@#$ out of them. Then, when he has you on the ground, bloody bat poised to smash your face in, you smile smugly and say, "What if I could make you an offer you can't refuse?"


WHICH OPTION MAKES MORE SENSE?

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From the behind the scenes material in relation to the video, I got the impression that Raynor's reckless behavior was intentional and not so much an oversight. It's meant to show he's starting to crack and that he's looking for vengeance so hard it's starting to cloud his better judgement.

What Valerian was thinking is another matter and harder to explain. Why didn't he simply call up the Hyperion to tell them everything rather then have Raynor board his battlecruiser? I guess it was some form of "let's see if he's really as good as they say he is" type of test, though I'm certain there are better ways to find that out.

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This is the way my thinking goes, too. I imagine the Dominion was probably taken by surprise by Raynor's maneuver and closed distance with the Bucephulus quickly. By the time they had weapons lock, they'd be risking damage to the Bucephulus too. Valerian probably allowed it to gauge Raynor and his actions in the heat of battle. Moreover, if he is as manipulative as his father -- which I do not doubt -- it would be easier to influence Raynor in his increasingly deranged state, sprinkled with adrenaline and desperation as it was.

And I'm sure l33telboi, who last posted in November 2012, will appreciate your year-and-a-half late response to his post, VoK. :P

Oh I know, I'm just bringing his comment back up in response to Gradius. Plus I'm bored as hell.

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Originally Posted by Visions of Khas

I imagine the Dominion was probably taken by surprise by Raynor's maneuver and closed distance with the Bucephulus quickly. By the time they had weapons lock, they'd be risking damage to the Bucephulus too. Valerian probably allowed it to gauge Raynor and his actions in the heat of battle.

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There's a lot of "taking things for granted" for that theory to even make logical sense. The problem is partly because it's so "up in the air" that one is left to actively think up of a convenient explanation on their own to make that scene even logically acceptable when it is plainly and simply nonsensical. It's an alarming trend in Sc2 I've noticed.

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Originally Posted by Visions of Khas

Moreover, if he is as manipulative as his father -- which I do not doubt -- it would be easier to influence Raynor in his increasingly deranged state, sprinkled with adrenaline and desperation as it was.

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Valerian knows Raynor is deranged? Didn't know he was that omniscient. If he knew Raynor was deranged, I must also assume that Valerian knows that he could entrust the task of artifact collecting to Raynor and somehow still expect him fulfill this potentially difficult task?

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Originally Posted by Visions of Khas

Plus I'm bored as hell.

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Happens when we haven't really been given much to talk about.

How about guessing where Tychus ran off to while Raynor was being buddy-buddy with Valerian? >_>

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Originally Posted by RetlocLive

How about guessing where Tychus ran off to while Raynor was being buddy-buddy with Valerian? >_>

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Like WoL's story, going nowhere most likely.

I wouldn't call going off a cliff no where. There may be little progress in terms of distance, but definitely a steep drop in altitude.

Guys, StarCraft II's story has flaws enough without having to make them up. Where was Tychus? Maybe he went looking for more Marines to fight because he clearly enjoys it. Maybe he didn't want Mengsk to see him because Mengsk has a killswitch for Tychus' suit. Maybe Raynor asked Tychus not to come in because this is all personal for him. Maybe Tychus twisted his ankle and fell behind. Tychus could have been there, or not, and it really doesn't make a difference. This is not a plot hole, it's just something that happened that could have happened a different way.

And really, this is a massive step up. Where were Fenix's troops when Antioch Province was overrun by a single Hydralisk? (The answer, of course, was off recharging the batteries on their psi blades. Silly Fenix, that's what you get for not properly maintaining your equipment).

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Originally Posted by FanaticTemplar

Where were Fenix's troops when Antioch Province was overrun by a single Hydralisk? (The answer, of course, was off recharging the batteries on their psi blades. Silly Fenix, that's what you get for not properly maintaining your equipment).

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This always bugged me a bit, but we can kind of excuse it considering the graphical capabilities of a rendering engine 15 years ago. I'd love to see a modern rendition of the scene with up-to-date 3-D animation quality. Something more akin to the HotS Zerg Rush opening cinematic.

Honestly, I'd love to see what any/all of those old cinematics or mission briefings would look like with modern Blizzard-quality animation (maybe with some considerable down-scaling of general weirdness/inconsistencies, eg the size of the Battlecruiser that fell in that opening cinematic). Today's animation mixed with the dialogue from back then? Yes, please.

Yeah, it's obviously system limitations. The whole batteries failing thing is probably the same - they couldn't animate a fight like Zeratul's in The Prophecy so they just used visual shorthand to show that Fenix was going to die.

That cinematic's just my go-to example when I feel that people are being unreasonable in their criticism :P.

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Originally Posted by FanaticTemplar

Guys, StarCraft II's story has flaws enough without having to make them up. Where was Tychus? Maybe he went looking for more Marines to fight because he clearly enjoys it. Maybe he didn't want Mengsk to see him because Mengsk has a killswitch for Tychus' suit. Maybe Raynor asked Tychus not to come in because this is all personal for him. Maybe Tychus twisted his ankle and fell behind. Tychus could have been there, or not, and it really doesn't make a difference. This is not a plot hole, it's just something that happened that could have happened a different way.

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Who's making stuff up? There seems to be a lot more "maybe's" in your post than what I said; guess it wouldn't hurt to throw in another one would it? Maybe Tychus was doing nothing at all. Doesn't necessarily have to be taken as a criticism, mind you.

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Originally Posted by FanaticTemplar

Yeah, it's obviously system limitations. The whole batteries failing thing is probably the same - they couldn't animate a fight like Zeratul's in The Prophecy so they just used visual shorthand to show that Fenix was going to die.

That cinematic's just my go-to example when I feel that people are being unreasonable in their criticism :P.

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Rahhh, they could've done so much more, though. T_T

Like, in other cinematics, we could have gotten some sort of aftermath, something like the flashlight flickering on the ground after those two terrans got killed. Imagine if instead of fading to black right after the battery outage, we had gotten another wide exterior shot of nothing, but with distant, echoing battle sounds and hydraiisk screams. Then, after all was quiet they could have crossfaded to a shot panning over the seemingly dead body of Fenix... but surrounded by 3 dead hydralisks as well! No additional animation needed, just additional render time.

I don't know if it would've made for a better cinematic, but it would have shown that Fenix was a badass, that he took some of them with him, which was something we never got.

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Originally Posted by Turalyon

Who's making stuff up? There seems to be a lot more "maybe's" in your post than what I said; guess it wouldn't hurt to throw in another one would it? Maybe Tychus was doing nothing at all. Doesn't necessarily have to be taken as a criticism, mind you.

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There are a lot of "maybe"s in my post because there are a lot of reasonable explanations. It's only a plot hole if you choose to disregard them all, and at that point it's not because of a failing of the story, but because of your own choice. It's not like Tychus' absence is something that demands an explanation - that way lies endless minutia.

It's still pretty funny to think about though. I always pictured Tychus still killing off Dominion soldiers, but is then caught off-guard when Raynor and Valerian enter and scene and tell him they've formed an alliance and he just has that WTF-just-happened face afterwards. :p

I could care less where Tychus went, but Heir Apparent is still one of the most teeth-gnashingly immersion-breaking cinematics in all of StarCraft. There is no reason any of you can come up with for why any marines had to die for a goddamn introduction. Period. I am seriously not accepting any counterarguments.

I'm not making any.

The best one I could make still don't work.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Gradius

There is no reason any of you can come up with for why any marines had to die for a goddamn introduction. Period. I am seriously not accepting any counterarguments.

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It was a dream. Makes perfect sense now. XD

Quote:

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There is no reason any of you can come up with for why any marines had to die for a goddamn introduction.

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Challenge accepted.

Without the cinematic, there would be no epic shoot outs for the previews at BlizzCon

What do I win?