[Assumption] First Shot Of The Brood Lord

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they haven't changed it enough for it to warrant a name change.

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That kinda depends on what the name change was for. As I understand it, once upon a time the name of the temporary unit spawned by the Swarm Guardian was a "Swarm". That was the new name for Broodlings. So its name made sense. When they decided to call them Broodlings again, the name no longer made sense. I mean, it made a little sense; it's a Guardian that creates swarms of things. But that's about it.

Brood Lord makes more sense in that it spawns Broodlings.

Personally, yes, I agree that the model for the old Swarm Guardian seemed more like a Brood Lord, and this thing is much more of a Swarm Guardian. I expected that when they changed the name and model, it would be to something that looked even less like a Guardian, not more. And maybe they'll eventually settle on "Brood Guardian" or some such.

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Take the time to make the new things work instead.

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You say that as though everything that they could think of could possibly work. There are ideas that can't work, and there are ideas where it is not worth it to make them work. That is, they would be too disruptive to the current state of the game to make work.

Less time spent on ideas that can't work is more time available for those that can. And as much as it might be cool to have mobile Nydus Worms, I'm willing to accept having Nydus at Tier 2 + Creep Drop as a consolation prize. The fact that it's early coupled with being able to use it offensively without a Hatchery constitutes enough of a difference to me.

Take Drop Pods, one of those popular abilities that got cut early after the Terran reveal. Would you really want Blizzard to spend the time working on that idea, trying different things, over and over for the past year and a half, only to cut it then? That would be a lot of time wasted on something that they had already determined wasn't going to work.

Now there is one thing I think Blizzard could do better: provide better fallbacks when they remove something. The entire Cobra->Firebat->Marauder+Hellion is the kind of model I'd like to see them doing more often. Where they take something out and put in something else, break that something down into its good parts, and distill that into a specific unit or ability. That was a good 6-month period where they were just working the space of possibilities, picking out ideas that they thought worked and putting them into the right place.

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if all else fails, should simply try it out in the Beta and look for the fans suggestions (and there will be plenty) to make it work.

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So you want Blizzard to hang on to ideas that they know aren't working until Beta?

There are certain levels of changes that you should be willing to make in Beta, and certain ones you shouldn't. Beta is for balance testing: number tweaks, maybe moving a few abilities around, and so forth are fair game. Large-scale mechanics like Nydus Worms are not; those need to be solid, because they affect all of the other things (number tweaks, etc). Change those, and you basically need to restart the Beta.

If they're still doing things like making up new unit abilities, adding new race mechanics, and so forth during Beta, then something is very wrong with Blizzard's development pathway.

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Originally Posted by ManjiSanji

The Banshee is more like a cloakable, shorter-range Guardian than it is a Wraith.
The Wraith was horrible at AtG, even with cloak.

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Yeah it is Horrible, that doesnt change the fact that they used it just for worker harassment...Dunno myb you are right but to me, they really looks the way i describe it, btw after all Viking in air form doesnt have AtG, no matter how horrible would it be, he doesnt have it... And it doesnt have Cloak neither...
I would say then that Goliath->Viking(In both forms) cuz it has his Role... they just give him air form for AtA attack...

Actual the Wraith is as close to the Viking's role as the Goliath, perhaps a little closer in fact, given that the Viking is a Starport unit.

The way I see it, the Banshee is completely new unit for Terran. It is basically a short range guardian with cloak and better mobility. I've been wishing a unit like this in the Terran air force even before SC2 was announced. The Viking acts like an uncloaked wraith in the air with meatier damage and acts a Goliath in the ground. The Goliath ground attack wasn't something to write home about, even if they did boost its range, so I hope the make the viking's ground attack a bit more interesting. Perhaps a continuous firing chain gun? It attacks continuously like void ray(in packets) and then it has a devourer/Battlecruiser like slow cooldown so the weapon doesn't overheat?

I won't discuss whether the Viking or the Banshee is closest to the Wraith, Valkyrie or the Goliath. All I know is that the two new units got aspects of all of them, and neither is a real "successor" to the other.

They're all different units with similarities and differences.

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Originally Posted by Dauntless

I won't discuss whether the Viking or the Banshee is closest to the Wraith, Valkyrie or the Goliath. All I know is that the two new units got aspects of all of them, and neither is a real "successor" to the other.

They're all different units with similarities and differences.

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Agree with this.

Seems to be the running theme of the Terrans and how they were developed.

They pretty much just took everything not named 'SCV', 'Marine', 'Battlecruiser' or 'Siege Tank' put them all in a big blender, then distributed what worked the best together.

Marauder got the Medic's early game support role with a newly created anti-armored infantry role (something that was desperately needed in SC1 in TvT and TvP). Reaper got the Vulture's attack and proxy-mines, while being an infantry unit. Hellion got the firebat's attack and the vulture's speed, range and mobility. Viking got the Wraith's air to air attack, speed and mobility and the Goliath's ground-to-ground attack, size and durability. Banshee got the Wraith's cloak. Dropship got the medic's healing and infantry-support role. Nighthawk got the Vulture and Siege Tank's ability to control terrain and had that greatly extrapolated. Among other things.

And I like the Viking's ground form. I think it'd be serviced better by being a factory-turned-air unit but in general it's strength is that it's very mobile, armored, and mechanical. And does generally good DPS. But it's defense is it's real strength, it's not vulnerable to Reapers, Hellions, Roaches, Hydralisks (maybe), Banelings, Zealots (maybe), Nullifiers, Marines ('nother maybe) or Ghosts.

Seems like they're mostly useful in mirror matches I'd say. Theoretically speaking.

Woah woah woah -- guys...

...take the stuff about capital ships and vikings and stuff to a new thread or something.



Anyway, the one thing that drove me nuts about the original Swarm Guardian was that the entire body undulated up and down, rather than just part. It was about as annoying as the original Stalker bouncy-walk. I think a great general look and locomotion for the Brood Lord would be that of a sting-ray. Just imagine this gargantuan beast cruising through the air, body perfectly level but with the outer "wings" moving up and down to propel it forward, creating a smooth sine wave.

I think it would look awesome.

I liked the wormy movement of the old Swarm Guardian, it looked Zerg like, UNLIKE the bouncy WC3 influenced stalker.

I notice it with the tank too a little. Just watch the beginning of the Terran Demo. When the tanks roll in, you see separate parts of the tanks bobbing up and down. While I can live with it, to me personally it feels like that's WC3 influenced - although not necessarily a bad thing, because I can't imagine a tank looking good at all if it was just a solid model moving across the terrain.