All new HOTS units - screenshots(SPOILER)

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Originally Posted by PuppyMaster

Zerg
- Swarm Host: Launching small, little, f***ing slow hydra-like creatures is ridiculously BAD and unimaginative. In the demonstration Blizzard made, they barely got to attack the buildings and that's because the freaking terran player decided not to go after the swarm host. It kinda overlaps with the infestor's ability to spawn infested terran, but the infestor has two more very powerful spells.

I would've like to see sort of an artillery burrowed unit, launching either small and slow attacks at a base or other units (like banelings) from a 9-10 range. The first time I saw the teaser image, this was what i originally thought of this unit.

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My thoughts exactly. The terran guy literally did nothing. Again, this unit is absolutely useless by itself, and again it needs a slew of support units. For such an expensive unit, it has a very high chance of actually DOING NOTHING.

That was 9 Swarm hosts people. NINE, and they cost 200/100 each. That's 1800 / 900 worth of material, and it literally did nothing. There was no push, no real tactical change to the gameplay or strategic response required.

Putting 1800/900 worth of Siege tanks or Colossus would seriously make the enemy race scared shitless. I can't imagine people even thinking about the Swarm host at this time.

Can you imagine the Swarm host actually doing ANYTHING against a toss death ball? Me neither. All their "projectiles" will be killed before they reach their target. It's like sending banelings into marine balls and watching them disappear. At least with banelings you can get lucky and 1 baneling kills like 50 marines but seriously, none of these game design ideas are for sure.

I think what they should be doing is launching these swarmlings, a la ground based brood lords. Then again it'll be pretty overpowered. The problem with artillery is that it has to have impact damage otherwise you're just sending hordes of people over the top to be mowed down by machine gun fire.

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Originally Posted by Gradius

You can't see how a hellion can be any more useful? For 100 minerals it roasts all the opponents workers then comes back later with the main army in meat-shield mode.

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I'm not negating the utility of a fast moving and somewhat high DPS harassing unit, namely the Hellion. But the Battle Hellion, as was told in the multiplayer panel, was designed to be used late game versus light opponents. Think of a scenario where you can catch off-guard a bunch of marines clumped together or a bunch of zealots wondering around lonely after 15-20 minutes of play. They will always be backed up by siege tanks, marauders/colossi, stalkers. Not even against zerglings they don't pose a serious threat because they are slow.
Though, you have point there, they could be used as meat-shields to soak up the first round of fire, while your tanks (army) redeploy(s) (kinda like the zealots, but without doing much damage in return).

Ok, for all of you who said something about useless and useful units, you can read the article here about the units and their usefulness, from the guy that played this alpha version: http://www.gosugamers.net/starcraft2/blogs/3427

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That was 9 Swarm hosts people. NINE, and they cost 200/100 each. That's 1800 / 900 worth of material, and it literally did nothing. There was no push, no real tactical change to the gameplay or strategic response required.

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Okay... what part of 'work in progress' don't you understand? =S The numbers can and will be adjusted.

It was a demonstration of a Zerg artillery unit. A ZERG artillery unit. The idea is overwhelming your opponent with numbers. Not blasting him to smitherines with sheer firepower. Same principle as the Brood Lord.

It was a group of them, trying to assault a concentrated position. The idea of Heart of the Swarm is to move AWAY from deathballs. The purpose of the Swarm Lord is to take map control. Like a siege tank. And spawning an army of what amounts to zerglings with 3x the HP and damage is going to be very strong, and very useful.

The problem is finding the thin line between too many and too few; too many of those little critters and no one will be able to defend against them. Spawning a small number of them, will make the unit useless.
You have to see the bigger picture: finding the magical number of units to be spawned is in direct relation with the damage made by the other units. If the tank receives a small buff or nerf then you need to rethink that magic number otherwise it will ruin the balance. And I'm not talking just about the tank. The concept is interesting but in reality I don't think it will work out as planned. I wish though to be wrong.

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Originally Posted by PuppyMaster

The problem is finding the thin line between too many and too few; too many of those little critters and no one will be able to defend against them. Spawning a small number of them, will make the unit useless.
You have to see the bigger picture: finding the magical number of units to be spawned is in direct relation with the damage made by the other units. If the tank receives a small buff or nerf then you need to rethink that magic number otherwise it will ruin the balance. And I'm not talking just about the tank. The concept is interesting but in reality I don't think it will work out as planned. I wish though to be wrong.

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Your wish has been granted; you are wrong. If they can balance the Brood Lord, they can balance the Swarm Host. If you consider the Swarm Host burrowing as equaling a Brood Lord attacking, there's basically no difference between the units mechanically when they produce Broodlings/Locust in set intervals.

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Originally Posted by PuppyMaster

The problem is finding the thin line between too many and too few; too many of those little critters and no one will be able to defend against them. Spawning a small number of them, will make the unit useless.
You have to see the bigger picture: finding the magical number of units to be spawned is in direct relation with the damage made by the other units. If the tank receives a small buff or nerf then you need to rethink that magic number otherwise it will ruin the balance. And I'm not talking just about the tank. The concept is interesting but in reality I don't think it will work out as planned. I wish though to be wrong.

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This is no different than the Infestor's spawn infested marine spell, or the spawn broodling spell every building has... or the Carrier's Interceptors... it's not a hard thing to balance at all.

I also think the Swarm Hosts need to be buffed up if they're going to be useful. The range on them seems to be fine, at least. That, or make them a cheaper, weaker version of the Brood Lord that has burrow, rather than flying.

And I also really hope that the Battle Hellion is an Armory-enabled upgrade... something with a high gas cost to balance out how freaking amazing they become for only 100 minerals a pop.

Does anybody Know if they changeling is still in the game/being improved upon. And if so does anyone know if the changeling can be used to keep the shredders off?

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Originally Posted by RODTHEGOD

And if so does anyone know if the changeling can be used to keep the shredders off?

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Now there's a neat idea...

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Originally Posted by RODTHEGOD

Does anybody Know if they changeling is still in the game/being improved upon. And if so does anyone know if the changeling can be used to keep the shredders off?

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I am pretty sure that Changeling is out of the game, at least out of the Multiplayer. Too bad, I like that little guy. ;/

Also, I am pretty sure that Swarm Hosts aren't bad at all, even in their current state as guy in that article said. Locusts are amazing, and that guy said that they last a lot longer than Broodlings, while Swarm Host produces them every 15 sec, which means that you can have 4-6 from one Swarm Host at the time, which to me sounds amazing. Little devils with 90 or 110 hp(what guy said in the article) and a lot of damage, that are free, they will eat enemy fire for sure, but that is what they are out for, while you charge up with Lings and Banelings.

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Originally Posted by Muspelli

Now there's a neat idea...

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Personally I didn't find the changling to be as cool as it could have been and I thought that blizzard could/should of expanded its role to be a saboteur by giving it an ability to self destruct or to "turn off" buildings. If it could also be used to disable shredders then I think it would be a pretty valueble unit.

I can't say I understand the hate for the Swarm Host.

It's clearly not so much a siege/damage unit, as it is a pressure unit. You plop them down in an area where you want your opponent distracted, where they might be able to just barely defend against a wave or two, and use the opportunity to hit them somewhere else.

The Locusts have a lot of health for being a free unit, so they're clearly meant to stick around and irritate, as opposed to destroy.

Could they use some kind of speed production buff? Sure, maybe, but that would take some careful balance.

Just a thought for how replicators may handle in campaign: 'Oh hi there Kerrigan. Say hello to my six replicators.'

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Originally Posted by Muspelli

Just a thought for how replicators may handle in campaign: 'Oh hi there Kerrigan. Say hello to my six replicators.'

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"Six Replicators replicating each other, huh? That's what you're going with?"

Wait...
So, you use a Replicator to mimic an Infestor and use Neural Parasite on an Ultralisk, at which point the enemy uses Neural Parasite on the Replicator...

Hang on, I'm gonna go draw me a schematic.

Imagine this in a game with all three races, somehow - you replicate an SCV, build up to a Ghost Academy, build a nuke, then replicate an Infestor, Neural Parasite an enemy Ghost and use it to target your nuke.

Did I just blow your mind?

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Originally Posted by Quirel

"Six Replicators replicating each other, huh? That's what you're going with?"

Wait...
So, you use a Replicator to mimic an Infestor and use Neural Parasite on an Ultralisk, at which point the enemy uses Neural Parasite on the Replicator...

Hang on, I'm gonna go draw me a schematic.

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Failed at making my point. I would love to see replicators copying Kerrigan.

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Originally Posted by Quirel

"Six Replicators replicating each other, huh? That's what you're going with?"

Wait...
So, you use a Replicator to mimic an Infestor and use Neural Parasite on an Ultralisk, at which point the enemy uses Neural Parasite on the Replicator...

Hang on, I'm gonna go draw me a schematic.

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Ooh, ooh! I know this one! It's a trick question because you can't cast neural parasite on an ultralisk.

:P

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Originally Posted by MulletBen

Ooh, ooh! I know this one! It's a trick question because you can't cast neural parasite on an ultralisk.

:P

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Which brings up the even MORE interesting question of whether you can cast Neural Parasite on a Replicator mimicking...

Oh, yeah, it replicates abilities too. Gotcha.