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Perfecttear
05-20-2009, 01:46 PM
..... Mothership.....
"The mothership has been switched back and forth from a one-of-a-kind unit to a normal unit, multiple times since its unveiling in May 20.The mothership is treated as a support unit with powerful defenses.
The mothership's standard attack consists of eight disruptor pulses that spread out and attack all enemies within range. These can attack both air and ground units. This makes them quite ideal as support in the back lines of a battle while capable of attacking enemies in the front lines. While the mothership has an immense amount of hit points, it is incredibly expensive and not worth the risk of being exposed to open fire. Players should expect the enemy to throw everything they have in destroying these immense vessels. Overall, it should only be built if one has air superiority and can adequately defend it."



Mothership's ability:
Cloaking Field: cloaks nearby ground units and structures
Vortex: creates a gravity vortex that incapacitates units in the target area
Wormhole Transit: allows the Mothership to instantly travel to Protoss building


scrapped abilities:
Planet Cracker:Scorch the ground beneath the Mothership for 15, seconds,causing damage to enemy ground units below
Time Bomb:Time Bomb slows down enemy unit movement and attacks in the area of effect
Recharge Energy:Recharges the energy of a friendly unit.
Summon:Summon target ground unit



To me the mothership fells like a rebuilded Arbiter, and really doesn't feel like a super unit that is meant to be the primary support unit of your army.
So i'm giving a challenge to the scl community, to come up with your abilities for the mothership, and help it regain it's former glory, so it becomes a unit that is more usefull and everbody likes.She doesn't have to be an end-game unit, she just need the correct abilities and stats to pay it off. :cool:






I really think that the mothership needs a direct damage ability, so here is mine:

Overload:
The mothership could receive a stronger Overload ability which was scraped from the Phoenix.The Overload area-effect discharge is devastating and can destroy a large number of enemies at once, but it comes at a price: in the aftermath the Mothership is left temporarily powerless and crippled. This would actually be a nice ability for the mothership, and far more usefull than the current ones.The overload ability might be overpovered for the phoenix but would be just right for the mothership.





Suggest
DIscuss

Blazur
05-20-2009, 01:55 PM
Here's a bunch of Mothership ideas I put forth on the old BlizzForums.

http://www.blizzforums.com/showthread.php?t=24758

Crazy_Jonny
05-20-2009, 01:56 PM
I dont really like Wormhole transit, its the least exciting of the bunch. Sure its suppose to save your Mothership, but at the expense of your energy, I'd rather build another Mothership. Maybe if they made it like TP from WC3, where it would warp your whole army back, it would be more useful. But really, Id rather see a scrapped ability (like timebomb) come back.

By the way, can you attack units in a Vortex? Or is it just like stasis field?

Perfecttear
05-20-2009, 01:59 PM
Hope you don't mind blazur, but i've copied your suggestions here so people can see them an discuss:)




By Blazur:

Translocation: This ability can be used to swap any two units, and can work on your own units, your enemies, or can be used to swap one unit of your own with an enemies unit. The way it works is you activate the ability and click any unit. That unit briefly begins to sparkle or glimmer, indicating the ability is about to begin. Then you click a 2nd unit, and the two are shifted in position after undergoing a warp-in animation.

The ability has many strategic uses. With it you can pull a siege tank down from a ledge and position a zealot up there. You can retreat a damaged immortal and replace it with a healthy one. Really the possibilities are endless.

Safeguard: The MShip is able to pass its shield onto friendly units, replenishing their own in exchange for hers. The only drawback is as she does this, her own shield is permanently depleted. As the ability is chanelled the dome above her is retracted, indicating how much of the ability has been used until it's completely gone. If the dome has receded half-way then the MShip can only restore half of her shields permanently. Safeguard can be deadly when used with Archons.

Psionic Disruption: Tapping into the raw power of a psi matrix, the MShip is able to channel her focus on any psi node to convert the energy into a force which is devastating to their opposition. That node will fainly illuminate the Psi matrix in red, and it will deal damage over time to any hostile units inside its perimeter for as long as the channeling is in effect. Psionic Disruption is excellent at defending base raids, or offensively when used in conjunction with a Warp Prism.

Energy Beam: The MShip drops a singular and powerful beam from the center of the ship. The beam has a short charging animation before it pulses down to the ground, dealing medium damage to a group of units and physically propelling them away from the point of impact in a radius. Larger units (Thor, Colossus, Ultralisk) and sieged tanks are not moved by this beam as they're implanted into the ground.

Polarization: The MShip emits a powerful magnetic charge that repels mechanical vehicles and ships. She can use this to carve a path through a fleet to open up safe passage, or to push back hostile ground units. Ships are more affected by this being in closer proximity, while ground units are moved less drastically. Polarization can be used while mobile.

Flashback: This one might be a little far streched and unrealistic given the fact that Blizzard cannot rewind replays. When Flashback is invoked, time travels backwards for a few seconds and all units/abilities/upgrades travel in reverse. When finished the players are allowed another chance to replay their original course of actions, changing history and possibly improving upon their strategy or correcting a fatal encounter. While activated players have free control over the map, and the MShip is revealed to all players if buried inside the fog of war.

Planet Cracker: Bring back the original spell with some slight modifications. So the MShip has three points on its perimeter and is constantly rotating. When this ability is activated a psionic beam is projected downwards from the apex of each of these ponts. As the MShip rotates these beams spin with it and carve a path of devastation across the ground, damaging multiple units. The slow moving ship makes this ability difficult to use with precision, but when maneuvered effectively can deliver maximum damage.

Fathership: Two allied motherships merge to form this bigger and deadlier...eh, never mind.

smoshrobotics
05-20-2009, 05:09 PM
I wanted to add Nicol Bolas's ideas from the previous thread as well.


Nicol Bolas's Ideal Mothership (all numbers subject to balance):

The Mothership is constructed from a Nexus; it is made available when you build a StarGate. It should cost on the order of 400/300. It should have an 8x4 attack (it can attack while moving), about 150/200 shields/Hp, and a reserve of 200 energy. It should be slow (slightly faster than an un-upgraded Overlord). It should come with the following abilities:

1: Wormhole. The Mothership teleports itself to the location of any Protoss building you control. Cost: 50 energy.

2: Shield Recharge. Units in the area of effect will immediately begin recharging their shields regardless of how long they have been in combat (attacking, taking damage, etc). For the next 8 seconds, the shield recharge will continue, regardless of whether they engage in combat. Cost: 125 energy.

Each of the highest tech buildings of the Protoss will enable the Mothership to gain a new upgrade. These upgrades are not on the tech buildings themselves; the upgrades are "researched" at the Mothership. The buildings just enable the Mothership to research them. The Mothership must remain immobile during research, but it can use any of its abilities or attacks as normal. The upgrades, and their associated buildings, are:

1: Cloaking Field (Dark Obelisk): The Mothership has a passive cloaking field that makes all units and buildings within the range of effect cloaked except itself.

2: Space Fortress (Fleet Beacon): The Mothership gains +150 sheilds, +150 Hp, greater speed (slightly slower than a Carrier), and 8 additional attacks from its main batteries per salvo. However, no more than 4 of these attacks can target an individual unit from any one salvo.

3: Mobile Nexus (Null Circuit): While in this mode, it acts as a Nexus with regard to Probes doing resourcing. Cost: 0.

4: Warp Tunnel (Templar Archives): What D-Squid said.

For each Mothership research, the Mothership gains +50 energy capacity. Don't forget about the ability of Dark Pylons to transfer energy into a Mothership.

If the Mothership is destroyed, it can be rebuilt. The new Mothership will have the upgrades that the old one finished researching. However, the new Mothership will also cost 50 minerals more per upgrade (the gas cost does not change).

starcraftguy13
05-20-2009, 05:14 PM
the mothership needs that energy beam from the SC1 intro, now that would really pwn!!

Whanhee
05-20-2009, 05:19 PM
Here are a few ideas I came up with earlier... Most of them revolve around the mothership being the toss version of the starbase.

Replace/link with nexus:
-Once mineral only expansion is depleted, the nexus occupying it becomes useless, unlike zerg which can produce from it or terran which can lift off, use scan or dismantle it.
Potential ways to fix it with mothership:
-Make the mothership capable of being a resource drop off (perhaps at the cost of energy or minerals per second). This may not be a good idea because it can move to right next to the resource line, making resource gathering abnormally fast.
-Make nexuses capable of transferring shields or energy to the mothership. This may or may not involve giving energy to nexuses.
-Give the mothership the ability to open a warp portal to move nexuses around. Or alternatively, allow it to build a portal thing which allows probes to enter and exit from near mineral patches to near a pre-existing nexus. For a mineral cost, it would be cheaper and faster, but because the probes have to enter the portal, and the portal would presumably need to be distanced from nexuses, resource gathering would be slower.

Give it building abilities!
-Make it capable of building air units.
-Make it the stargate version of the warp gate, generating its own radius though.
-It must be built by a probe. Rip off of thor much? It's huge anyways.
-Give it the shield regeneration thing that the distruptor has (or the templar, not sure). Would be interesting with the nexus shield transfer thing above. Field shield battery!

Miscellaneous abilities:
-Repulsion: Prevents air units from entering an area. Defend against banshee harass and keep vikings from being able to lift off!
-Overload: Being what I envision as the centrepiece of the protoss psi network, make it overload itself and either cover the map temporarily with psi, reactivating all powerless structures and enabling warp gate drops everywhere you have sight (maybe imbalanced =\) or cause all your pylons (and maybe the little glowing ball on top of the nexus) to glow and start repairing all nearby structures.
-Stasis Field: What it is.

Lol:
-Abduction: Kidnap a nearby enemy ground unit. You do not gain control of it. You may drop it whenever you choose. Killing the mothership kills the unit.
-Finale: In memory of gantrithor.

Building unit hybrids. Its where it's at.

Freespace
05-20-2009, 05:41 PM
the mothership needs that energy beam from the SC1 intro, now that would really pwn!!

You mean the planet cracker.


The Mothership should do what motherships usually do, and that is support the fleet.

As such, the Mothership should have:

1. Extendable Shields: The Mothership will extend her shields over a large perimeter around her, protecting all airborne allies within for up to 150 points of damage. Lasts 10 seconds. 75 Energy cost.

2. Adun's Presence: All air units around the Mothership will preform much better regarding speed, damage, shield and energy recharge. This is a passive ability.

3. Warpout: It selects a single enemy unit and warps it into the nearest star's atmosphere => instant kill. 100 Energy cost.

4. Self-Destruct: When all is lost, the Mothership can activate it's singularity core and take out the enemy with her. This would be the equivalent of the Protoss nuke, though it will deal great damage ( 400-500 ) to air units and only half of that damage to ground units.

Whanhee
05-20-2009, 05:48 PM
Self-Destruct: When all is lost, the Mothership can activate it's singularity core and take out the enemy with her.

Should be called the finale. :P

I disagree with the when all is lost bit. I see it as being more of an opening maneuver. As you attack a base, you charge with the mothership forcing your opponent to scatter his units as fast as possible. If he doesn't, you destroy his army, if he does, you fake out and your actual army rapes his disorganized one. Not quite the fight to the death move you're looking for imo.

Freespace
05-20-2009, 06:04 PM
Should be called the finale. :P

I disagree with the when all is lost bit. I see it as being more of an opening maneuver. As you attack a base, you charge with the mothership forcing your opponent to scatter his units as fast as possible. If he doesn't, you destroy his army, if he does, you fake out and your actual army rapes his disorganized one. Not quite the fight to the death move you're looking for imo.

Well Lore-wise, it really doesn't make sense to go self destruct your mothership before the battle even starts ( hence the "when all is lost" ). Game-wise, sure lots of people would do it - it's a hell of a threatening/intimidating move to have your mothership charge at an unsuspecting army.

loath42
05-20-2009, 06:15 PM
I don't understand the wormhole-to-protoss-building hate.
With phase prisms being extremely mobile, your mothership could be anywhere you can get a prism. Those warp-in drops people are so excited about? you could do them with your mothership, kill EVERYTHING then jump back to your base once the cooldown is up.

Zigurd
05-20-2009, 06:16 PM
You could allow the self-destruct mechanism when the Motherfuck is at 50 or less HP.

Either way, I like Nicolas's's's's ideas. It would add a lot of depth to the Motherfucker.

Blazur
05-20-2009, 06:23 PM
I don't understand the wormhole-to-protoss-building hate.

Wormhole is an interesting idea, but its too similar to the town portal of WC3 which I despise. It would seem too easy for it to simply warp away after you invest so much time and effort into severely damaging it.

Fun for the Protoss player, but frustrating for the opposition.

I'm not fond of any self-destruction mechanism on any Protoss unit.


It would add a lot of depth to the Motherfucker.

Haha! Didn't even catch that the first time I read it. I'm SO gonna steal your little nickname when referring to this unit.

Freespace
05-20-2009, 06:24 PM
You could allow the self-destruct mechanism when the Motherfuck is at 50 or less HP.

That's a great idea!

n00bonicPlague
05-20-2009, 07:00 PM
I don't remember if the Mothership is unique now or not, but either way, I think the best way to have this unit is non-unique but with a very high resource and supply cost -- something on the order of 12 to 16 psi and mineral and gas costs in the middle to upper hundreds. This would make perfect sense for the Protoss, since they are all about high power units with high level costs. It would make the Mothership very unique and powerful, but it would not upset the balance of the game like allowing only one would do. If you have built a unit, it must be accounted for in the supply cost.

Another thing is that the Mothership shouldn't have any primary weapons -- none at all. It should be made a straight-forward caster. It doesn't matter if it seems odd that it doesn't have any weapons. If it is to function properly, it needs to be a caster in the purest sense. The weaponry should be saved for the Carrier, Void Ray, and Phoenix. This will allow the Mothership to be the extremely powerful caster it should be.

Now, for my ability ideas:

Wormhole Transit

Same ability, but only works with Pylons, Dark Pylons, and Nexuses, as opposed to all buildings anywhere.

Vortex

Essentially the same thing as the current Vortex, but only against air units. It creates a large circular AoE where air units currently in the area and entering the area become trapped for a duration of time. They would be able to neither move nor fire nor cast, but units outside the Vortex would be able to fire and cast on them. This would affect enemies and friendlies alike, although lore-wise it could be argued that the shields of a particular Protoss faction are modulated in order to be able to resist a Vortex from a friendly Mothership.

Gravity Phaser

Much like the Phoenix's Anti-Gravity, but with a few twists. It would still be a channeling ability, it would still lift ground units into the air as air targets, and it would still be single target. But the Mothership would be able to sustain up to something like 8 beams at a time and would be able to move and even cast other abilities while channeling the beams (except for Quantum Rupture). Each added beam would increase the energy drain rate by a progressively smaller fraction of the of the previous beam's added drain rate. So, the total drain rates would follow a pattern similar to this:

1 beam = 1/1
2 beams = 1/1 + 1/2
3 beams = 1/1 + 1/2 + 1/3
4 beams = 1/1 + 1/2 + 1/3 + 1/4
5 beams = 1/1 + 1/2 + 1/3 + 1/4 + 1/5
6 beams = 1/1 + 1/2 + 1/3 + 1/4 + 1/5 + 1/6
7 beams = 1/1 + 1/2 + 1/3 + 1/4 + 1/5 + 1/6 + 1/7
8 beams = 1/1 + 1/2 + 1/3 + 1/4 + 1/5 + 1/6 + 1/7 + 1/8

Casting range would be about 6, and a beam would be automatically disabled if the Mothership moved to far from the targeted unit. All beams are disabled when either the energy runs out or when the player presses a designated toggle button that disables all active beams (like a cloak toggle, but separate from the main ability button).

Naturally, this would require the Phoenix to lose its Anti-Gravity ability.

Quantum Rupture

This ability deals channeling damage to a large circular area with a radius of 10 -- the epicenter being directly under the MS itself. At the epicenter, the ability uses 5eps to deal 50dps to air and ground targets; however, the ability deals less and less damage as the radius increases ([50dps]/[radius]) to where, at the max radius, only 5dps is dealt. With a full energy bank, the MS could deal a total of 2000 damage to the epicenter but only 200 to the edge -- this over the course of 40 seconds (normal game speed). Of course, as the level of available energy decreases, so does the amount of damage that can be dealt.

The ability is not affected by any special armor or unit types and is not affected by armor points, which means only a Hive at full health could survive the onslaught of a MS at full energy (though it would still suffer terrible terrible damage). This ability also affects friendly units (so it wouldn't be a good idea to cast it in your base). When this ability is activated, it drops the MS's shields to zero, making it very vulnerable to long range attacks and abilities, which are the keys to stopping this ability. After the ability stops (either out of energy or turned off), the shields must recharge from zero, which should be fairly easy with the new super-fast recharge rate (if the MS is not being attacked).

As I said the key to defeating this is a long range attack or ability, preferably from a higher tier unit. The BC's Yamato Cannon or Missile Barrage, the Thor, the Ghost's EMP, the Warp Ray, the Corruptor, and other units and abilities could all be used to defeat the MS while it is using this ability -- especially since its shields are dropped.

If considered imbalanced after tweaking the numbers around, other little twists could easily be added to make it work. Some of these include adding an initial casting cost (25e), allowing the shields to remain at full, not affecting friendly units (or even recharging their shields), and the list goes on.

So yeah......that's it. Complex, yes -- but I think that's how the Mothership should be. :)

EDIT: apparently, there are quite a few BF tags that don't work here on SCL......

Perfecttear
05-20-2009, 07:31 PM
Uh nice, so many suggestions.:) I really like the Quantum Rupture ability, it fells so fresh and inovative.

Zigurd
05-20-2009, 07:55 PM
Haha! Didn't even catch that the first time I read it. I'm SO gonna steal your little nickname when referring to this unit.

No prob bro. Just remember to say it with courage and honor.

In my opinion, the Motherfucker is quite nice as it stands. It just needs one offensive generalist ability. Let's say it's an ability that must be used in conjunction with another.

For example, you cast Vortex on a group of units, they remain immobile. Then you cast another ability by the Motherfucker that needs quite some time to channel, so you cannot use it effectively with moving units. Or it's an ability only castable to units under the effect of Vortex.

Call it however you want, but it does damage to units. Good damage, about 150 or so.

Then the Motherfucker would be quite complete I believe. It would be mainly for defense, with it's teleportation, Vortex and Cloaking field. But it could have offensive applications, with this new ability and an upgraded main attack.

Whanhee
05-20-2009, 10:17 PM
I don't remember if the Mothership is unique now or not, but either way, I think the best way to have this unit is non-unique but with a very high resource and supply cost -- something on the order of 12 to 16 psi and mineral and gas costs in the middle to upper hundreds.
I really think this would be hard to balance. I mean... it COULD work, but it would be very hard. For example, terran has the all powerful EMP which would make its investment worthless and zerg has... not much at the moment, which is what concerns me.


Another thing is that the Mothership shouldn't have any primary weapons -- none at all.
Adding weapons to casters isn't so bad, it keeps them useful even while they have no energy. For such a huge investment that you suggest, having no armaments at all would be slightly silly imo. However, I agree that the mothership should be if not a full caster, at least mostly a caster, with more support abilities than attack abilities.


Gravity Phaser
The ability to disrupt an enemy's entire economy is very powerful. Sounds cool, but I dunno about how it will work with other protoss units. Zealots and immortals for example can't attack air units and phoenixes may be obsolete because the mothership might do their job of antigravity better than them.

Also, about them fractions, lim k -> inf (sum n=0 to k of 1/n) is infinity.
Basically 1+1/2+1/3+1/4+1/5+....= infinity


Quantum Rupture

I don't like this ability. It involves you mothership charging into enemies alone because it damages your units as well. It does ridiculous amounts of damage, enough to level a base while being very difficult if not impossible to stop.

Even the 200 damage at the edge is enough to destroy most units while no anti air unit has a range of 10, in other words, once this gets started, everything in its radius DIES no questions asked.

The Motherfuck can just fly to the side of a chokepoint and destroy it without any chance of retaliation.

What I think might be better would be to have a total damage per second and distribute that among all enemies nearby.

MattII
05-21-2009, 03:17 AM
Repair - The MShip can pick up any unit (air included) of up to 4 pop. (population) (excludes only Carrier and Colossus) and repair/heal it at 20hp/second.
Psi Warp - The MShip warps all units in the area of a Pylon or WPrism to its location, at a cost of 2 energy/pop. for ground units, and 5 energy/pop. for air (units in transports aren't counted)
Anti-Gravity - can pick up any unit, but the initial cost is 25 energy/per psi to lift, and 1 energy/psi/second channeled. Can pick up multiple units.

Noise
05-21-2009, 04:51 AM
I like the passive cloak and Vortex, but I think the third ability could be a lot better. I think that it should be similar to the original recall and more of an offensive spell.

For example:

Warp Inversion - works the same as recall, except the Mothership is teleported to where you cast it, swapping the Mothership with a number of your other units. Very high energy cost. So you could use it simply to get your mothership out of there, or as a recall. Obviously can only be cast where you have units or a nearby building or something like that.

Perfecttear
05-21-2009, 05:13 AM
The mothership needs to have atleast one offensive damage dealing ability.

Grrblt
05-21-2009, 08:12 AM
I really like someone's suggestion that the Mothership should take over the Phoenix' old overload ability. It made little sense to have it on a weak but fast fighter (you'd always fly into the midst of the enemy and use it - no thinking). It makes loads of sense on an expensive spellcaster. Especially if it's a unique-built one. And it makes much more sense than a self-destruct thing too - you'd never purposely destroy your Mothership. Overload is really the only last-ditch defense mechanism that make sense IMO. And apart from a possible planet-cracker, it should also be its only attacking spell.

I don't really keep track of what abilities already belong to other units (they've changed too much around and I haven't been able to keep up) but these are other abilities that feel Mothershippy to me. And these are all thought out from the one-mothership-per-player perspective.

Planet cracker: u no it. This ability is conceptually too cool to let go, and it also fits with SC1 lore. Perhaps it needs to be changed from its first designs. I can see some Independence Day city buster weapon working: you get in place, slowly fold out the big cannon, and if you still haven't been shot down, you turn everything on the ground in a pretty big radius around you to ash. Radius should be large enough to make a significant impact on a battle, but not so large that you can hide your mothership behind your immortals and still win with it.

Transfer energy: can give or take energy to/from friendly units. Used storm on your two high templars already so they only have 40 energy each? They're useless unless they can merge to an Archon, which takes time. Take the 40 from one of them, give that 40 to the other guy and you've got enough for one more storm. Would also work if you have other mothership abilities and too little energy to use them - just steal some from your nearest friendly spellcaster.

Recharge/extend shield: I think there's a Protoss unit that already has recharge shield ability and I'm not saying it works better on the Mothership, just that it works. I think someone else also suggested giving MS a way of giving her own shields to friendly units; your colossi are taking a beating but it's the MS's shields that go down. Should work on an AoE basis if so, but not necessarily a radius around the MS itself (could be ground-targeted).


I also feel the mothership requires some sort of enemy crowd control but all the good ones I can come up with are taken. There's the old stasis field (but we want to move away from the arbiter), there's the anti-gravity and there's the forcefield. I don't like the time bomb ability because it's so conceptually lame and if you want to convince me that the Protoss can manipulate time and put it in a bomb, then at least make the manipulated time effect all units in that area.

Maybe you could get some "psionic block", probably channeled, to prevent spells being cast into and/or out of an AoE could be good. It either works as a silencing spell, or it works like a Dark Swarm for magic instead of bullets. Lore-wise its usability might be limited against Terran, seeing as how most of their special abilities are actually science and not magic, but that can easily be explained away by calling it something different.


What I don't like is the cloaking field. Mothership should already be your enemy's #1 priority to kill. Let's not make it the only thing your enemy is able to kill.

Wayward Meteor
05-21-2009, 09:49 AM
I don't have any ideas for abilities but I'm all for the Mothership having an awesome attack spell and being limited to one at a time. Come on people, this is the Protoss. Mothership. It needs to be huge and impressive and powerful. I want the game to tell me "Enemy Mothership Detected" and cause excited panic like SC does with "Nuclear Launch Detected".

The cloaking ability is really lame.

n00bonicPlague
05-21-2009, 09:59 AM
If there is gonna be a cloak, it should cloak EVERYTHING, imo.

MattII
05-21-2009, 03:25 PM
The mothership needs to have atleast one offensive damage dealing ability.

That or a standard attack.

Perfecttear
05-21-2009, 03:27 PM
That or a standard attack.
You don't know that the mothership has an standard attack :o

Combat
Ground Attack 8 (x8)
Air Attack 8 (x8)
Armor 2
Range 7
Speed Normal

MattII
05-21-2009, 03:34 PM
You don't know that the mothership has an standard attack :o

Actually I do, I'm just pointing out that it only needs a damage-dealing ability if it loses that attack.

Whanhee
05-21-2009, 05:34 PM
If there is gonna be a cloak, it should cloak EVERYTHING, imo.

Maybe not buildings, and definitely not allied units, imo. A 400 food cloaked army would not be fun =\

MattII
05-21-2009, 06:45 PM
Maybe not buildings, and definitely not allied units, imo. A 400 food cloaked army would not be fun =\

Yeah, but if you put 400 popultion under the MShip you're going to lose every base but that one, because you've grouped your units together, and neglected your base defences.

Personally I don't think cloak 'works' with the MShip like it did with the Arbiter, it just doesn't seem the same in my mind.

Lupino
05-22-2009, 02:32 PM
I agree, cloaking just seems too slapped-on for the MS to work. For one thing, with all your other units cloaked your MS becomes the prime and only target for the enemy, and the cloaking effect would be too easily neutralized by enemy detectors.

I like the idea of the MS providing some sort of buff to other friendlies, like an extendable shield. That, combined with a return of Black Hole, would make the ship much, much better than its current "fat Arbiter" role, especially since it's back to being a unique unit.

Whanhee
05-23-2009, 10:27 PM
Suppose the mothership had no shields and instead gained shields based on the shields of all surrounding units, and it protected all of them distributing damage to all units instead of one taking all the brunt. It would definitely be useful vs emp and tanks, though it might be bad for immortals if they need to absorb more damage than their hardened shields need to.

It may be a bit stacked though, so it might be just a redistributing factor, units that have more shields can transfer their shields to other units via the mothership (automatically, can be disabled or target specific units, i'm not too sure how it would work). It would help protoss especially since because they have large units, it's often hard for them to bring all their forces to bear all at once. And it would allow those not fighting to help replenish the shields of those that are + rapid regen while not fighting.

MattII
05-24-2009, 01:10 AM
Too random, a function as essential as shields shouldn't have to rely on other units.

n00bonicPlague
05-24-2009, 01:31 AM
Gosh, I hate this. I wish they would just bump the Thor and Mothership over to Campaign and UMS and just let them retain their original glory. The Protoss have so many new units that it wouldn't hurt to bring the Arbiter back with re-vamped tricks. Same goes for the Terrans -- they've got enough new stuff. Just create some new unit or something as a Thor replacement.

MattII
05-24-2009, 01:48 AM
Stuff the Arbiter, let's see some more of the Star Relic (maybe with a name change).

n00bonicPlague
05-24-2009, 11:15 AM
Stuff the Arbiter, let's see some more of the Star Relic (maybe with a name change).I wouldn't mind that either. I just think that the Mothership should be the MOTHERship.

Zabimaru
05-24-2009, 11:25 AM
MOTHERship.

Anyone thought of the Daddyship yet? :p Or will that just belong to Reach? The Manship?

Anyway, the Mothership has gone through the most changes out of any unit- so obviously there is some difficulty balancing the thing. Of course this does have to do with how high it is on the tech-tree. I like the idea of it being the capital ship, but it has lost its former glory... I don’t like the idea of it being entirely defensive either- a mix of the both seems right to me. And the shield idea is a bit too random.